Dave’s Comments (group member since May 24, 2014)

Dave’s comments from the Reading Proust's In Search of Lost Time in 2014 group.

Yeah, I was a Henry Miller enthusiast when much younger. Have you read his "The Books in My Life"? Now there was an essay. I was (and am) big on essays on reading.

Heh, If its a book I'm tempted Jonathan. I read a number of essayists when younger but can't think of the last time. So no, probably not.

Meanwhile, what happened to your Proust picture? I always told folks I was in direct contact with the Master himself. Now there is this ruffian smoking a cigarette! Mon Dieu, what would Proust's grandmother say.

Which brings to mind, did anyone in ISOLT smoke? I don't recall. Marcelita?

Over the last few days I have been rereading Roger Shattuck's book since I know Renato plans to read and Jonathan is reading his book. This was one of the first books I read when I finished ISOLT last Summer. But I need to qualify that statement. I read hardly any non-fiction cover to cover, sequentially, or completely. Rather I read "around in" them grazing as my current interest suits me. However, this rereading, I read most of the book at one point or another. There are places I didn't read before where I get lost. I think I understand the basic "stereoscopic" idea, but I don't follow the pseudoscientific justification. Its an interesting idea, but its not provable with math on a blackboard, lets move on.

My experience with this Proust material is that no two critical books, blogs, video's etc agree on much of anything beyond some basics. That's Ok, I consider what they say, take what I find useful, leave the rest and move on.

That was interesting Marcelita. Thanks!

I agreed with your assessment about the natural ending when I finished Jonathan. My opinion changed later about the remaining pages.

I have finally found an author who states that Proust meant for the book to be reread. David Ellison is Professor of Humanities at the University of Miami (FL). His short book "A Reader's Guide to In Search of Lost Time" has great discussion about the text. But the point I want to note is that near the end of the discussion of Swann's Way he writes:

"As is often the case in the Recherche, Proust presupposes a second reading of his novel for its structural coherence to emerge in the mind of his reader."

Earlier there is a paragraph about the role of rereading in understanding Swann's Way.

Jonathan wrote: "Dave wrote: "The extended section dealing with "people look different when you haven't seen them in a long time" was tedious and belabored the obvious...."

I agreed with this point Dave. Proust wa..."

I read this part too fast the first time. I got a lot more out of it when I reread it a couple of weeks ago.

Jonathan wrote: "When I read the section (approx two paragraphs) where Gilberte's & St-Loup's daughter, approaches the narrator I got goose-bumps. It's the section that starts 'I saw Gilberte coming towards me.' Wi..."

I had a very similar reaction Jonathan. I thought Mlle Saint Loup was the personification of the book. I read somewhere that in the Library he realizes what he will write about and Mlle Saint Loup is his inspiration to write. Nobody has the same opinion on this type of thing so we are free to decide for ourselves.

My reaction to post-Mlle Saint Loup text was, if anything, less charitable than yours. I kept muttering "alright already, go write the book." I would think that many would have a similar reaction. But now I understand that to "get" the ending you have to reread the beginning. Now I consider the ending to be brilliant.

Jonathan, I also found it confusing trying to sort out who was whoat the Matinee. Seeing you set out Odette as you did made me think that her social oblivion matched that of Swann

Congratulations Dwayne! An interesting post-Proustian exploration. Proust seems to have such a profound effect on readers.

He he, yes, that garden gate bell is pretty insistent!

CONGRATULATIONS Jonathan!

Interesting Jonathan. Which translation are you reading? Does she have a drawling voice? My MKE search did not pick up this instance. Its worth considering that the quote you originally quoted refers to MLLE Saint-Loup.

No Renato, I don't resent my parents any more. But your well written Proustian sentiments probably have less to do with my forgiveness than the fact they have been dead for several decades and I've been in therapy for ten years! ;)

What a neat story, and such interesting memories dredged up. Jonathan, I had a whole chest of drawers full of Disney comic books my mother threw out which infuriated me. At some other point I got pissed at my parents and packed some toys in a small square suitcase and marched through the living room where my parents were sitting and announced I was running away. My father said "Have a good trip." I stormed back to my room and slammed the door. Proust speaks for all of us in one way or another I suppose.

We hadn't heard from you in a few days Marcelita. Glad you are back.

Welcome Ben! Thanks for for joining us. Looking forward to your comments. Lets us know if we can help in any way.

I went back to look at that passage to see if Albertine "fit" the text. I think so but that part seems really complex! The book becomes a reality of its own and the readers become the Narrator's rivals who "profane" his love (for Gilberte, the Duchess, and Albertine) by thinking of the applicability of his love to that of women in their own lives! Anyway, grandmother and Albertine are repeatedly named in the section and all other character are consigned to obscurity so that's why I think Albertine fits.

Jonathan wrote: "I'm intrigued by this bit when he's talking about how his grandmother was unhappy with the narrator's unproductive life and about how the characters in his life had found their way in one form into..."

I love a good sleuth so I electronically searched the MKE Version (only one I have electronically in one book) for the word "drawling". There were four occurrences found included the one you cited Jonathan. The second occurrence was Swann voice and the third was a man but I didn't look to see who. The first, in Balbec I was Albertine herself:

"In speaking, Albertine kept her head motionless and her nostrils pinched, and scarcely moved her lips. The result of this was a drawling, nasal sound, into the composition of which there entered perhaps a provincial heredity, a juvenile affectation of British phlegm,"

Then I searched for "deep-set" and found only two occurrences (including yours) the first was a detailed description of a female statue by the young Marcel at Combray. This description is very latently sexual. My guess is Proust linked Albertine's appearance to this statue of Marcel's youth but of course the statue would have no voice. Possibly an editorial slip that an intention to describe Albertine as having derp-set eyes never was written in. or perhaps there is one using other words in another translation (or the original French). Proust could have used electronic word search capabilities to keep track of the details.

Jonathan wrote: "Renato wrote: "The moment where he decided how he would write his novel and how everything started with Swann gave me chills to read! It's a long quote, but worth to be put here, for sure:
"In sh..."

I am very interested in these passages about the reader in the library. There is another sentence or two along the same lines. I find them very significant.

Yes, clearly the hawthorns are important and the quote you selected is a great one. There are a lot of memorable parts of the book but if asked to name a favorite I would choose Combray.