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Deep Ancestors: Practicing the Religion of the Proto-Indo-Europeans
Through a combination of the linguistics of a reconstructed language, archaeology, and comparative mythology, Deep Ancestors breathes life into the ancient Proto-Indo-European culture and religion. Ceisiwr states "This book must be considered a report on a work in progress. As time goes by, new research will be done, new ideas and data presented, and old texts and archaeology reinterpreted. This will require changes in the beliefs and practices of reconstructed Proto-Indo-European religion. Consider this a process of progressive revelation, except that instead of coming from the gods it comes from scholars."
298 pages, Paperback
First published October 19, 2009
About the author
Ceisiwr Serith
13 books48 followersI have been married since 1981 and a father of a daughter since 1982. My wife is simply amazing; quite easily the smartest and nicest person I have ever known. She has a very successful career as a vice-president at an insurance company and as an actuary, a Fellow of the Society of Actuaries. On top of all this, she is cute. I don't just mean cute in a physical sense (although she is). Cute is as cute does, and she does cute. I sometimes wonder how I ever won her.
My daughter is, of course, equally amazing. As well as being beautiful (not just my and my wife’s opinion, by the way), she is brilliant. She speaks Spanish fluently, and shows an interest in languages in general that makes me very happy. Like her mother, she has a big heart, but like her father she still can accept some of the hard facts of the world without blinking. I hope this will come in handy in her chosen field of social work. She's a truly amazing combination of the best of both of us, with her own mysterious nature added.
I myself was born in 1957, in North Tonawanda, NY, and spent my early years in Tonawanda. These two towns, separated by the Erie Canal (they are, in fact, where the canal really ends, despite what the song says), are delightful reminders of a nicer time. Visiting them is like taking a trip back in time.
I didn’t live there long, though, since my father was in the Air Force. We lived in a number of places, including Germany. It was while we were there that I went to Berlin. This was while the Wall was still up, and I was privileged to see it, and to cross it into East Berlin. The contrast between the two was shocking -- the West, a vibrant, colorful, living city, and the East, a city of grey, with rubble left over the WWII, even then in the late 60s. When I was taking classes at the University of Massachusetts years later, I would see Communist students handing out copies of the Daily Worker, and I would want to shake them and scream, "You've never been to East Berlin. You've never seen the Wall."
For college I went to Holy Cross, a good Catholic school, where I met my wife. I received a degree in psychology, with a secondary concentration in Eastern religions, in 1979. The fact that after twenty-five or so years my training in psychology is obsolete leaves me with mixed feelings. I am grateful, however, that pyschology majors were required to take a course in statistics. That has stood me in good stead, and I think that everyone should be required to take it, on at least a high school level. We are confronted daily with statistics -- polls, gambling odds, and such -- but few of us really understand them. Many people still believe that if a series of coin flips has come up consistently heads, the odds against the next flip coming up heads are greater than 50%, or that the odds against a shuffled deck of cards being in order by suit and number are greater than those against any other order. Just the other day I read how in a poll the majority of people polled believed in one thing, with the breakdown something like 49/47%, with the rest undecided. A plurality rather than a majority, but it was even worse; the error of measurement was 4%. In other words, statistcally speaking, the question was tied. People should know these things. But I digress.
After college I served in the Air Force myself, as a communications officer, stationed in England. (I had gone to college on a ROTC scholarship.) My wife and I developed a love for England and the English, and have been back a number of times. We have even considered living there after my wife retires.
I served my hitch in the Air Force and got out. I won't say that the Air Force and I parted on the best of terms, but I know that both of us seemed relieved. My wife and I didn’t like the idea of someone else raising our daughter in daycare, so we decided one of us would stay home and take care of her and the house. My wife wanted to try the working world. Fortunately, I was quite eag
My daughter is, of course, equally amazing. As well as being beautiful (not just my and my wife’s opinion, by the way), she is brilliant. She speaks Spanish fluently, and shows an interest in languages in general that makes me very happy. Like her mother, she has a big heart, but like her father she still can accept some of the hard facts of the world without blinking. I hope this will come in handy in her chosen field of social work. She's a truly amazing combination of the best of both of us, with her own mysterious nature added.
I myself was born in 1957, in North Tonawanda, NY, and spent my early years in Tonawanda. These two towns, separated by the Erie Canal (they are, in fact, where the canal really ends, despite what the song says), are delightful reminders of a nicer time. Visiting them is like taking a trip back in time.
I didn’t live there long, though, since my father was in the Air Force. We lived in a number of places, including Germany. It was while we were there that I went to Berlin. This was while the Wall was still up, and I was privileged to see it, and to cross it into East Berlin. The contrast between the two was shocking -- the West, a vibrant, colorful, living city, and the East, a city of grey, with rubble left over the WWII, even then in the late 60s. When I was taking classes at the University of Massachusetts years later, I would see Communist students handing out copies of the Daily Worker, and I would want to shake them and scream, "You've never been to East Berlin. You've never seen the Wall."
For college I went to Holy Cross, a good Catholic school, where I met my wife. I received a degree in psychology, with a secondary concentration in Eastern religions, in 1979. The fact that after twenty-five or so years my training in psychology is obsolete leaves me with mixed feelings. I am grateful, however, that pyschology majors were required to take a course in statistics. That has stood me in good stead, and I think that everyone should be required to take it, on at least a high school level. We are confronted daily with statistics -- polls, gambling odds, and such -- but few of us really understand them. Many people still believe that if a series of coin flips has come up consistently heads, the odds against the next flip coming up heads are greater than 50%, or that the odds against a shuffled deck of cards being in order by suit and number are greater than those against any other order. Just the other day I read how in a poll the majority of people polled believed in one thing, with the breakdown something like 49/47%, with the rest undecided. A plurality rather than a majority, but it was even worse; the error of measurement was 4%. In other words, statistcally speaking, the question was tied. People should know these things. But I digress.
After college I served in the Air Force myself, as a communications officer, stationed in England. (I had gone to college on a ROTC scholarship.) My wife and I developed a love for England and the English, and have been back a number of times. We have even considered living there after my wife retires.
I served my hitch in the Air Force and got out. I won't say that the Air Force and I parted on the best of terms, but I know that both of us seemed relieved. My wife and I didn’t like the idea of someone else raising our daughter in daycare, so we decided one of us would stay home and take care of her and the house. My wife wanted to try the working world. Fortunately, I was quite eag
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Displaying 1 - 14 of 14 reviews
March 23, 2015
FOr those of you that hold an interest in the spirituality of the Proto-Indo-Europeans then this book will be the one for you to read. THe author is very knowledgeable about the different Pagan religion if Europe, such as the Norse. Celtic and even going further into the realms of the Hindus. All of these rate necessary for a work of this order because they are Indo_Europeans. From somewhere near Central Europe or along the Southern part of Russian, or near Armenia the proto-Indo-Europeans spread out practically all over the world. Going as far West as Europe and far East as India. If you examine these religions you will find out that they have much in common. after all they come from the same source.
Many people are under the impression that old EUrope was a peaceful goddess worshipping place and that the Ino EUropeans who stormed into Europe were warlike horseback riders who worshipped male gods. Such talk is nonsense. Old Europe knew it's share of violence and wars. Not all Indo European culture was spread with the use of violence and war. In fact a lot of it spread through trade and people admiring their ways. There were also peaceful migrations where in the Indo -Europeans learned from their neighbors and their neighbors learned from them.
Documents pertaining to the Indo Europeans and their rituals are scant and far and few between . This of course leads to an accurate as can be reconstructions, most likely pulled from Norse, Hindu and Celtic sources. THe book delves into the hisotry of the people, common laws and customs along with reconsructed rituals at the end. If going Indo-European is your thing or you need a good strong book on Pagan religions then this book is yours to read.
Many people are under the impression that old EUrope was a peaceful goddess worshipping place and that the Ino EUropeans who stormed into Europe were warlike horseback riders who worshipped male gods. Such talk is nonsense. Old Europe knew it's share of violence and wars. Not all Indo European culture was spread with the use of violence and war. In fact a lot of it spread through trade and people admiring their ways. There were also peaceful migrations where in the Indo -Europeans learned from their neighbors and their neighbors learned from them.
Documents pertaining to the Indo Europeans and their rituals are scant and far and few between . This of course leads to an accurate as can be reconstructions, most likely pulled from Norse, Hindu and Celtic sources. THe book delves into the hisotry of the people, common laws and customs along with reconsructed rituals at the end. If going Indo-European is your thing or you need a good strong book on Pagan religions then this book is yours to read.
July 14, 2014
This is a VERY interesting book. Taught me a lot of really useful things. Serith knows his stuff, when it comes to the religion of the ancestors of European pagans (of the Greeks, Romans, Germanic tribes, Celtic tribes, Vedics and many others). Concepts that I had never encountered before, like the roots of Celtic (etc) deities in, for example, the prototype cow goddess and mare goddess, throws new light on the ideas I'm playing with, as a modern druid and CR. Similarly, the Indo-European creation myth really helps with the background of the Norse world tree, and why it is reflected in other cultures. This stuff is just fantastic. Unfortunately, Serith is better at theology and history than he is on the creation of a workable, modern religion based on these ancestral beliefs. For example, he supports the idea of retaining the patriarchal (and gender-normative) system of these ancient beliefs - which may have worked for those ancient tribes, but isn't going to work for us today. Serith doesn't attempt to wrestle with these issues. But for anyone who is building a religious/spiritual path inspired in some way by pre-Christian beliefs, this is a fantastic introduction to where those beliefs came from. Highly recommended.
April 7, 2024
I generally don’t care for books on how to conduct rituals as they are all essentially someone’s personal interpretation of what potentially happened in the past and they are always watered down. In saying that, I enjoyed the parts of this book where the author dived into to potential beliefs of our PIE ancestors. It definitely added some ideas to ponder over. The author explicitly stated he had more information and sources but that the book was just too huge to provide them all. This is actually a pretty quick read, so disappointing that it was felt necessary to leave information out. Don’t let my criticism sway you from reading this book though. It was an enjoyable read and could be a nice source of insight for any pagan book collection.
December 29, 2017
I read this book some time ago, but since I've had it out again it felt like a good time to put up a review. I consider this book a success, a look at a reconstruction of the spiritual lives of our long gone ancestors. It has it's limitations. It's published by a small, small press and it looks like it, from the type face to the proof reading. It has no table of contents, searching it is not easy. The rituals as presented do not inspire me, for the most part. The break down of the cosmology, deities and spiritual concepts are spot on and shed a lot of light on the descendant traditions.
December 31, 2015
My problem with this book was a problem with expectations. I was expecting to read a book about the Proto-Indo-European religion, but this book actually behaves as if someone is trying to practice said religion. Large parts of the book appear to be largely made up rituals based on some scrap of information--or made up entirely, I couldn't tell. In any case, I got through it really quickly by skipping all of that and just reading for the parts which try to use the comparative method to figure out the religion. Those parts were pretty good, but I'm glad I borrowed it on Amazon instead of buying it.
April 1, 2010
Amazing book. Check out my review: Deep Ancestors
July 29, 2017
Bad buy. I initially thought it was about reconstruction of the protoindoeuropean religion, instead, neopaganism is presented and propagated (even with embarrassing prayers!). It is not possible to separate serious research from fiction. Linguistic etymology is in part interesting, but I know too little in the field to be able to judge what is reasonable. As far as mythology is concerned, it presents some general knowledge, some daring conjectures that may be true, and some conjectures that seem dubious to me, for example the warrior hero, who defeats chaos, as an indoeuropean specific. He appears in other cultures too (e.g. Marduk / Tiamat), perhaps in all. The book also seems to generalize too much and to see too many symmetries. Everything is arranged according to so few patterns that it seems unbelievable to me.
I have bought the book despite its suspicious title, because the reading sample had been more modest and constrained with respect to speculation and fiction. The description at Amazon had not been very informative. The price of the book had been so low that I quickly gave it a try without first looking into Goodreads, a mistake.
I cannot recommend the book to historically interested people, it is rather something for the esoterics corner.
I have bought the book despite its suspicious title, because the reading sample had been more modest and constrained with respect to speculation and fiction. The description at Amazon had not been very informative. The price of the book had been so low that I quickly gave it a try without first looking into Goodreads, a mistake.
I cannot recommend the book to historically interested people, it is rather something for the esoterics corner.
July 23, 2021
Finally got around to reading this book. So I would recommend this book if people are interested in some comparative linguistics and some comparative mythology. But really it’s made for people interested in developing a personal practice that draws on common Indo European themes. After the first couple of chapters a lot of what you get is the author making an educated guess about how we could bring these traditions into contemporary practice. It’s creative work and he’s pretty straightforward about that. All of my critiques are about reconstructionism in general. For example, there’s a fall ritual which is about welcoming back the people who’ve been taking care of the herds or who have been out on Warrior campaigns and re-integrating them into the household. I don’t see the point in maintaining a gendered division in a contemporary ritual. Most of us are not out doing herding, but some of us are out doing other things and need to be re-integrated. I think it makes a lot more sense to divide things based on what people are actually doing with their real lives to make the ritual as effective and meaningful as possible.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
April 2, 2018
In a way I now recognize as silly, I expected this book to be much less conjecture. Even with such a contentious topic lacking any strong evidence outside comparative linguistics and mythology, this book is much more personal gnosis than historical reconstruction. More space was taken up in this book by the author's personal prayers to various personally constructed deities than to any really relevant information.
In summary, I got this book because it was free and J.P. Mallory's was $50.
In summary, I got this book because it was free and J.P. Mallory's was $50.
January 30, 2020
Well. This was new. Quite literally, because the author blends unverified personal gnosis with Wicca-esque prayer/elements and throws in some Proto-Indo-European for good measure. To each their own. If it makes him happy, more power to him. It just wasn't 100% for me is all.
February 15, 2023
Scholarly and Spiritually beautiful
I was surprised by how well researched this book is. I am fascinated and inspired by how much can be reconstructed.
I was surprised by how well researched this book is. I am fascinated and inspired by how much can be reconstructed.
April 5, 2018
Very disappointing and poorly documented. I was expecting research on the topic of indoeuropean studies but ended up with a book more or less related to new age religion:
The religion of the Indo-European - practiced by the author! A few good reference to Indo european myths. Too proselitic. He lost me on the second part when he is trying to teach the religion and I had to give it up which I do rarely.
The religion of the Indo-European - practiced by the author! A few good reference to Indo european myths. Too proselitic. He lost me on the second part when he is trying to teach the religion and I had to give it up which I do rarely.
June 29, 2011
This is a fun book whose main drawback, other than a lack of chapter titles in the table of contents, is that it likely appeals to a limited audience: it is too speculative for the academic reader, and too niche for the popular reader. If, however, you happen to be a practitioner of a modern reconstruction of Proto-Indo-European religion, this book is a necessity. There are nice tidbits as well for other IE reconstructionists and similarly inclined NeoPagans.
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June 12, 2021Bought by accident when it was recommended to me during a research foray. Far too conjectural to be of interest to me anthropologically or historically; far too irritatingly patriarchal and didactic to appeal to my heathen side. Altogether vexing.
Displaying 1 - 14 of 14 reviews