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For Want of a Nail: If Burgoyne had won at Saratoga

Robert Sobel

3.97 · Rating details · 240 ratings · 29 reviews

For Want of a Nail is an alternate history classic. The outcome of one battle in the American Revolution diverges from reality, and sparks an unstoppable chain of events which affects the history of the whole North American continent. In reality, the British general John Burgoyne, heavily outnumbered by American troops, surrendered his army to General Horatio Gates at the ...more

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Paperback, 442 pages

Published February 19th 2006 by Greenhill Books (first published March 1973)

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May 08, 2012 Rob Roy rated it it was amazing

Shelves: alternate-history

The concept of this book is staggering. I've read many alternate histories, and they are basically novels, where history takes a different line, but the same people appear, and event are similar. This alternate history is rather a history than a novel. It is written as a classic survey history. The premise is that Burgoyne wins at the Battle of Saratoga, and thus the American Revolution collapses. As the history moves, it becomes more and more divergent from what really happened. If you are a lo ...more

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Jul 27, 2010 Bernard Watkins rated it it was amazing

For Want of a Nail is a singular work in published alternate history. Unlike the masses of fictional works set in alternate worlds, and the occasional description of an alternate history for the purposes of overt what-if questions and roleplaying sourcebooks, its format is of a nonfiction book from an alternate world. Specifically, a history book written just like a real history book, but detailing the history of an alternate timeline. The writer, Robert Sobel, is a business historian and he has ...more

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Jul 25, 2010 Rachal Myers rated it it was amazing

This is the best alternative history I have ever read. Its like a textbook for a different time line. Very creative and plauable.

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Aug 27, 2018 Alan Phoenix-Bates rated it it was amazing

A fascinating book. I had to remind myself that this was a work that ended in 1971 on several occasions - this was mainly to come to terms with my disappointment that conclusions were already being referred to in the 1950s of this book's timeline.

Still, I enjoyed it. It's a slog to get through because it rewards attention to detail - but the effort is worth it.

All in all, it's a great premise, executed brilliantly.

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Oct 01, 2014 Nick rated it liked it

Most (in fact, all the ones I can think of off the top of my head) alternate history books are novels; This book instead reads like a history textbook, complete with copious fake footnotes. I found this approach to be quite refreshing. (It helps that Sobel is very committed to this format, going so far as to include a very critical essay from a fake historian at the end and pages and pages of made-up books in the bibliography.)

The departure point is (checks title) if Burgoyne had won ...more

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Nov 01, 2018 Googoogjoob rated it it was amazing

Shelves: favorites

It's hard to decide whether to give this book four or five stars. I think it is sort of a flawed masterpiece. It's a history of North America from the middle of the 18th century to the then-present day (1971), but from an alternate timeline where the American Revolution failed. It details the history of the two major nations North America eventually spawned from this point of divergence, in the form of a relatively dry popular history or textbook. It's very, very unusual. I kind of love it, but It's hard to decide whether to give this book four or five stars. I think it is sort of a flawed masterpiece. It's a history of North America from the middle of the 18th century to the then-present day (1971), but from an alternate timeline where the American Revolution failed. It details the history of the two major nations North America eventually spawned from this point of divergence, in the form of a relatively dry popular history or textbook. It's very, very unusual. I kind of love it, but it has some issues.

Pros:
-Extremely detailed; there is a tremendous labor of imagination put into constructing this plausible alternate world
-There are lots of footnotes in the text, all citations to nonexistent books or newspapers from this alternate timeline, each with a fictional author, year of publication, and city of publication; almost all of them are collected in a bibliography at the end of the book
-There are lots of tables of statistics and election results, all of course fictional and cited from fictional publications
-The book proper ends with a scathing critique of the book by a (fictional) historian from this alternate timeline, who has biases and inclinations diametrically opposed to the book's author, who has the name of the real-world author Robert Sobel, but is otherwise totally different; it points up potential alternate readings of the history of the alternate timeline, and is also funny simply as a parody of brutal academic put-down reviews
-Basically, everything possible is done to produce a convincing false document, which is great

Neutral things/comments:
-Probably because of the author's background as a professional business historian, one of the three major powers whose history the book ends up covering is a fictional mega-corporation. It's sort of interesting in that this predates cyberpunk by a decade or so, but posits a business as potentially a major independent player in world affairs; unlike most later fiction, however, this fictional company (Kramer Associates) is not depicted as particularly evil or corrupt; even when it's working to subvert democratic norms it's depicted as being essentially benign- although the critique at the end of the book calls out the author for being overly sympathetic to Kramer
-Maybe because of when it was written, right in the middle of the real-world Cold War, the fictional history ends in what is basically a fictionalized Cold War, with a stalemate between major powers and a nascent concept and reality of Mutually Assured Destruction enforced by nuclear weapons
-Likely intentionally, the book is pretty dry and sometimes dull, with very little authorial voice. I'm perfectly fine with this, because it is of course supposed to be a textbook written by a middling historian from this alternate world, but if you try to read this book as you would a novel, you would probably be disappointed

Negatives:
-There are a lot of errors in the book. Not errors about the history of this fictionalized world, of course, because that's impossible, but internal errors, like certain chapters giving incorrect dates for events of earlier chapters; inconsistencies about geography- eg, St Louis is at one point referred to as if it were on the opposite bank of the Mississippi as it is in our world, although it was founded pre-divergence point; errors of terminology- the monarch of the Ottoman Empire is referred to as "Shah"; and simple typos, especially in non-English names- Guatemala is referred to as "Guatamala", Chapultepec is "Chapultapec". Later tables of Mexican election results all seem inexplicably to omit the state of Mexico del Norte
-There aren't enough maps: the original 1973 book contained in the front matter a map of the alternate-history North America as of 1971, but with substantial errors in the map relative to the text. The modern edition of the book, or at least the 2002 softcover edition, omits even this map, despite claiming to be "complete and unabridged". It'd be preferable to have several maps of America at various points in the history, but to have none at all is kind of unforgivable
-Broadly, Sobel- the real Sobel, but also the fictionalized one- seems to have been very knowledgeable about the American Revolution, and about business histories, but sadly deficient in knowledge outside these areas

(As a side note, tangential to the quality of the book: even though it's good that the book got reprinted at all, the reprint is disappointing. It was reprinted in hardcover in 1997, when Sobel (the real-world one) was still alive, and it's unfortunate that the publishers did not take the opportunity to fix some of the errors I mentioned above. Perhaps Sobel was too old or ill to supervise any changes- he died two years later- but even so, there are problems that could've been fixed without adding or changing anything substantive. The reprint uses the exact same typesetting as the 1973 original, including typos, and including several typesetting errors: in one chapter, a footnote number is skipped; in another chapter, the numbers of two footnotes are swapped, so that footnote 30 comes before footnote 29. The dates for several presidencies/governorships given in the tables at the end of the book contradict the text of the book. These problems, plus the map thing, are very disappointing.)

Overall, despite the (mainly technical) issues with the writing, I think that this book is brilliant, and totally unique. There really wasn't anything quite like it when it was published, and even now it's unusual. There are other works presented as authoritative histories of alternate timelines, but they are almost all produced by amateurs and hobbyists (that is, not trained historians), and almost none of them are professionally published in a physical format. It's a trailblazing work of alternate-history, and even now in 2018, after there's been sort of a boom of alt-history fiction over the past 30 or so years, it's remarkable for its thoroughness, imagination, and depth. It's great. ...more

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Mar 07, 2017 Carolyn rated it it was amazing

I am not even halfway through "For Want of a Nail" and already I have decided that the book is the best alternative history I have read by far. I finished 1776 by David McCullough and could not help but wondering what if? The success of the American Revolution was just a close run thing. It could so easily have turned out differently. It should have turned out differently. So I decided to finally take "For Want of a Nail" off my shelf. I have not been disappointed. Robert Sobel does a masterful ...more

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May 31, 2014 Christopher marked it as to-read

Shelves: fiction-alternate-history, own-yes, read-no, fiction, _reviewed, _books-to-study

This is a book I truly hope to read someday. Robert Sobel's For Want of a Nail is apparently considered one of the godfathers of the alternate history genre.

For science fiction fans, also, it is perhaps an ideal example of a 'butterfly effect' novel with a richly detailed alternate world flowing from the crucible moment.

However, from what I gather, it's a book which requires the reader to have more than a passing knowledge of the history of the American Revolution. And that's This is a book I truly hope to read someday. Robert Sobel's For Want of a Nail is apparently considered one of the godfathers of the alternate history genre.

For science fiction fans, also, it is perhaps an ideal example of a 'butterfly effect' novel with a richly detailed alternate world flowing from the crucible moment.

However, from what I gather, it's a book which requires the reader to have more than a passing knowledge of the history of the American Revolution. And that's why I've been hesitating to read it.

With this alternate history novel, Sobel examines a what-if scenario: What if British General John Burgoyne's invasion army actually prevails over the American counterforce at Saratoga, New York, in Sep-Oct 1777, leading to the collapse of the American independence movement?

From that point, the novel loosely follows the diaspora of American independence leaders, and it outlines what the North American continent might have looked like in the wake of an American defeat. It is a very different North America from that which we are familiar.

It's an absolutely fascinating scenario and a great idea for a book, even though it's clearly not mainstream stuff. Sobel writes this exactly like a history book, replete with detailed footnotes of fictional source material. There's even a postscript in which a fictional peer reviewer (from the novel's alternate history) critiques Sobel's work!

As an exercise in putting together an alternate history written with scholarly structure, there are probably very few peers to this book, if any. Accordingly, I expect this will be very dry and daunting, like a real history book, as Sobel meant it to be.

At this point, I know I'm not ready to tackle this book until I read at least one good account of the Battle of Saratoga and its aftermath, so I can know exactly where Sobel's novel diverges from the historical record and takes flight. I think a general understanding of America's transformation in the 19th century would also be beneficial--then I could follow the continuing divergence into the 19th and 20th centuries. Without it, I expect the divergence will appear increasingly muddled and confusing, and ultimately unsatisfying.

It is a groundbreaking novel, and I'm proud to have a copy for my eventual reading, but I know it is not a novel for the casual reader of history. I suspect it would be a serious challenge to the average reader of alternate fiction, too. I wish there were more authors brave enough to write books like this. ...more

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May 29, 2012 Mark rated it liked it

Over the past few decades, alternate history has emerged as an increasingly popular sub-genre of science fiction. Through it, an ever-growing number of authors and fans have postulated the different turns that history might have taken, often because of relatively minor circumstances. Most writers use this to establish a divergent setting for fictional works, in which characters come to terms with the very different worlds that emerged as a result.

In this respect Robert Sobel offers s Over the past few decades, alternate history has emerged as an increasingly popular sub-genre of science fiction. Through it, an ever-growing number of authors and fans have postulated the different turns that history might have taken, often because of relatively minor circumstances. Most writers use this to establish a divergent setting for fictional works, in which characters come to terms with the very different worlds that emerged as a result.

In this respect Robert Sobel offers something different. Rather than develop an alternate history setting for a work of fiction, he created something far more elaborate – a thoroughly articulated timeline of events resulting from a British victory in the Battle of Saratoga. From it, he envisages an American Revolution that ends in a British victory and the emergence of two different countries – the British-spawned Confederation of North America and a separate state founded by the surviving revolutionaries that evolves into the United States of Mexico.

In developing his alternate world, Sobel presents it in the form of a “nonfiction” text rather than that of a novel. This is a considerable undertaking; instead of simply drafting a setting, he has to develop an increasingly intricate sequence of events, all of which must be plausible in explaining broader developments that took place over the following two centuries. Adding to the challenge is that he does this within the context of a narrative “history” without the benefit of the novelist’s devices of character and dialogue to maintain the reader’s interest.

All of this makes Sobel’s achievement an impressive one. Not only does he present a plausible and fully realized alternative to the history with which readers will be familiar, he does so in a way that can keep a reader’s attention. In many respects, it reads as a satire of a true nonfiction work, complete with footnotes citing nonexistent books and fake disputes between academics who never lived. It serves as just one more strata of a richly-layered work, one that may not be as exciting of a read as the works of authors like Harry Turtledove but one that can envelop the reader in a way that few other works of the genre are able. ...more

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May 20, 2008 Leonard Pierce rated it really liked it

Shelves: history

The book that basically kick-started the modern alternate-history movement (and by a business economist, no less, which is probably why he has a big corporation end up with the A-bomb). This thing is really well-researched and fun as hell, but almost painfully detailed and actually quite bizarre.

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Jun 05, 2018 Janis rated it it was amazing

In this book the American revolution never happened - it started then fizzled out. In turn this caused a ripple effect felt globally. No World war 1, World war 2 was started much later and it was not fought over race but oil in the middle east. The great ruling families in Europe were not removed from their thrones - the French revolution would eventually happen but it would be 60 years later and on a much smaller less violent scale, the czars kept power and there was no people's revolution and ...more

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Mar 24, 2017 Alice Lemon rated it it was amazing

Shelves: category-fiction, topic-hist-modern

This book was incredibly neat, if only because it was written in a way that science fiction and alternate history never are, but in which I wish they were. Specifically, it’s written as a non-fiction work about the world it’s set in.

Since I’m often as interested or more interested in the development of a world than in the development of characters, I wish more books were written this way–but then, I’m someone who reads history books for fun.

For Want of a Nail is a history of North America from ...more

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Mar 24, 2018 Rodney rated it really liked it · review of another edition

Shelves: alternate-history

Excellent alternate history. Different than others I have read...

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Oct 11, 2012 Michael rated it liked it · review of another edition

This book was a unique reading experience. I'm glad I read it, but I never really got into it.

As a work of fiction it was too dry. As a work of non-fiction it was very weak on technology and geography - both of which I consider to be heavy players in history.

Then there were the footnotes. The carefully formatted footnotes are the defining part of this book. They made me want to "suspend disbelief" but their persistent use broke up my reading rhythm. Worse than that: knowi ...more

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Apr 01, 2015 Bodicainking rated it it was amazing

A beautifully rendered alternate history book, written as a text book in a complete "in universe" style (with footnotes, alternative analysis and more of the trappings of academic history) which marvelously, in its plodding this-led-to-this whiggish way, demonstrates how what is history is always contested ("many have crossed the Rubicon, why do we only remember Caesar?").

And it ends with a private corporation becoming a nuclear world power, with its own island-state (Taiwan) to itse ...more

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Jan 25, 2010 David R. rated it liked it

Shelves: alternate-history

As Alternative Histories go, this one is intiguing but ultimately unsuccessful. Sobel carries a supposed timeline from Saratoga in 1778 to the 1970s and writes in the form of a textbook. Sobel is an economist, and it shows. The stuff is dry, packed tight with imaginary economic and political statistics. But as importantly, good alternative history requires real people and Sobel's treatment is top heavy with imaginary characters, especially after the last real one disappears in the alternate 1840 ...more

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Aug 09, 2012 Mel rated it really liked it

I'm amazed at how this fictional (written in textbook style) alternate history book from over 40 years ago can relate to some of the problems we are seeing now. I think some of the premises are far-fetched, but hey, isn't that what alternate history is supposed to be? Read it (if you can find it) and see if there aren't things that our current politicians and talking heads are going on about.

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Jun 19, 2015 Jessica Frances rated it it was amazing

I heard that this was the "Citizen Kane" of alternative histories, that was nominated for the Pulitzer Prize and gave it a read. This was a wonderful, thought provoking, book. It is like you went in a dimensional travel machine and grabbed a text book and brought it back to this world. I couldn't stop reading it.

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Jul 28, 2013 Fresno Bob rated it it was amazing

best, most detailed alternative history I've ever read, basically the Loyalists "win" the American Revolution and most of the "Radicals" (the people you'd recognize as the Founding Fathers) split off from the colonies and end up founding "The United States of Mexico". It reads like a historical textbook. Great stuff!

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Dec 12, 2011 Jaybird Rex rated it really liked it

The concept of non-fiction alternate history is still seeking justification in my frontal lobe, despite my having got through the book. This one's plausible, even interesting, but may give you the distinct feeling you're wasting your time.

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Apr 17, 2016 Dan rated it it was amazing

Shelves: alternative-history

I've read this book a number of times and own a copy, I cannot think of another book quite like it. An alternative history book as opposed to a novel, creating an incredibly detailed and coherent alternative future, written in an academic but very readable style - a classic of it's type.

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May 29, 2014 Maz rated it really liked it

The likelyhood with the reality is amazing. The book so accurate in every detail that almost get bored in some paragraph and that gave even more plausibility to the (his)story. Enthrilling, I wish There were even an European version about the old continent events.

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Feb 01, 2013 James rated it did not like it

More like a college paper than narrative. I admired the work of creating a whole alternate history but read very dry.

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May 22, 2013 Will Teich rated it it was amazing

Shelves: favorites

Best alternate history book ever written, hands down.

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May 29, 2015 Michael rated it it was amazing

This was the first book I read of alternative fiction and still one of the best of the genre. Highly recommended.

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Jan 07, 2013 Raymond Thomas rated it really liked it

Shelves: alt-history

Brilliant book. Loved the style and the development of a truly different world instead of throwing in historical allegories to the point of distraction.

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Pat Dailey rated it it was amazing
Oct 22, 2014

Ian Racey rated it really liked it
Feb 17, 2010

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Warren Smit rated it it was amazing
Dec 17, 2018

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About Robert Sobel

Robert Sobel

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Robert Sobel was an American professor of history at Hofstra University, and a well-known and prolific writer of business histories. He was also a chess Master, who represented the United States at the 1957 and 1958 Student chess Olympiads; he defeated thirteen-year-old future World Champion Bobby Fischer at Montreal 1956.

Despite his prolific writings in business history, he is most fa ...more