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Charmides or Temperance

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3.51  ·  Rating details ·  568 Ratings  ·  48 Reviews
Plato (428/427 BC-348/347 BC), whose original name was Aristocles, was an ancient Greek philosopher, 2nd of the great trio of ancient Greeks--succeeding Socrates, preceding Aristotle--who between them laid the philosophical foundations of Western culture. Plato was also a mathematician, writer of philosophical dialogs & founder of the Academy in Athens, the 1st institu ...more
paper, 68 pages
Published August 31st 2007 by Dodo Press (first published -390)
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Ben Marcher To an extent, yes; but that whole cultural aspect of the older man and younger boy (a.k.a. apprenticeship) is examined across many texts of the…moreTo an extent, yes; but that whole cultural aspect of the older man and younger boy (a.k.a. apprenticeship) is examined across many texts of the Ancient world.(less)
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Manny
I'm just going to have to spell this out: the author is a pedophile. There's no reasonable doubt about it.

Charmides, an early volume in the very popular Socrates series, is a particularly clear case. There's a kind of vague plot, but basically it's not much more a step-by-step manual in the art of seducing young boys with smooth talk about epistemology, the relationship between philosophy and science, and the nature of virtue. The fact that Socrates is a role model to many overimpressionable men
...more
Greg

I dare say that what I am saying is nonsense, I replied; and yet if a man has any feeling of what is due to himself, he cannot let the thought which comes into his mind pass away unheeded and unexamined.

Synopsis:

Socrates, who elsewhere is described as quite ugly, is hanging out in a wrestling gym when this totally hot younger guy walks in. "Dude, he's hot," Socrates says. "Yeah, but wait till you see him naked, he's got a killer bod," Chaerephon says. "Hey Critias, call your hot cousin over here
...more
Manny
May 10, 2014 rated it it was ok  ·  review of another edition
Recommends it for: Philosophers who sleep with their grad students
[A singles bar in Athens. CHARMIDES, CRITAS, SOCRATES and OSCAR WILDE]

SOCRATES: ... Now consider again the nature of temperance.

CHARMIDES: Of what?

SOCRATES: It's an ancient Greek term that doesn't translate well into English. [Aside] Zeus, he's hot!

CHARMIDES: Oh... right.

SOCRATES: Well, if you possessed temperance, would you post better reviews on Goodreads?

CHARMIDES: You mean, if it had been invented yet?

SOCRATES: Naturally.

CHARMIDES: I guess not.

SOCRATES: Would you get more votes?

CHARMIDES:
...more
Sheyda Heydari Shovir
متن واقعی این کتاب رو نخوندهم و ترجمهش بانگلیسی رو خوندهم از بنجامین جوئت، لذا در مورد نثرش حرفی نمیزنم. کارمیدس اونطور که حدس زدهند و پذیرفتهند از دیالوگهای اولیه افلاطونه. قهرمان داستان دوباره سقراطه. سقراط از جنگ برمیگرده و میپرسه امردها کجان؟ کریتیاس هم میگه امردها زیادند ولی وایستا تا فامیل ما رو ببینی. بله در واقع کریتیاس فامیل کمسنش رو بسقراط تعارف میزنه و یکی از متون مهم فلسفی در چنین بستری اتفاق میفته. بهرروی باین ترتیب کارمیدس زیبای سادهروی وارد داستان میشه و سقراط میگه حالا باید دید ت ...more
Miriam
Aug 28, 2012 rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Recommended to Miriam by: philosophy class
Shelves: ideas
The teacher of the philosophy course for which I read this nicknamed one of the guys in the class "Charmides." I hope that kid got an A.
Paul Christensen
Jan 07, 2018 rated it did not like it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philosophy
This dialogue’s not of the best;
Its ideas appear near in jest.
‘Sophrosyne is mightiest
Of virtues’ (Heraclitus),
But Plato just makes it a mess.

Greybeard by Paul Christensen
Duffy Pratt
Oct 13, 2013 rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philosophy
On one level, this is just a primer by Socrates on how to pick up a hot guy. It's also a typical working of the Socratic method. People start out thinking they know something, but by the end, everyone sees they are better off now realizing that they know nothing at all. In one way, this dialogue is especially interesting, because there is no English translation for the virtue that Charmides is trying to define. Thus, when he is giving a definition of it, he's defining something that we really ne ...more
Simo Ibourki
Aug 23, 2016 rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philosophy
After reading a small homosexual introduction (Socrates feeling a "wild-beast appetite" for Charmides), I got lost in arguments and refutations of a what makes a person temprant, good or virtuous. Socrates as always keeps up with "I know nothing" attitude, all he does was listenning for the definitions and then jumping to argumentations and inferences (The socratic method 101). A good read if you want to know about anciant greek philosophy and culture.
Fernando Ferreira
Pequeno grande diálogo que, em meio à tentativa frustrada de alcançar uma definição satisfatória da sophrosyne, nos arrasta pelo caminho que vai de Eros - de seu impacto desnorteador - até a compreensão da necessidade inescapável da contemplação serena do Agathón.

"Mais um vez, Cármides, retruquei, olha com atenção para dentro de ti mesmo, considera o que faz em ti a presença da temperança e o que deverá ela ser produzir semelhante efeito, e, depois de bem refletires, dize-me com decisão e lealda
...more
Josh Anderson
May 03, 2017 rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
The judgement of people on this is a tad pedestrian. So what, Socrates was an old man who supposedly remained chaste, and had an inclination for young men. I say again, so what? Charmides age is never mentioned, I don't think, and is just called a 'youth' and was probably around 17 years of age, which the media agrees, is a very fine age when it comes to the human form. I'm sorry, but it kind of makes me sick the way we judge this even more because it is homosexual. Look at Sparta and the way th ...more
i!
An entirely strange dialogue in which Socrates and Critias both fail totally to find a satisfying, even to themselves, conclusion or definition. I couldn't stop thinking what a ridiculous figure Socrates must have struck to Charmides and his mates, although this sentiment is leavened in the end with some lighthearted, laughably creepy banter.

Some good things come about as byproduct. The science of man's self I think is a good enough conclusion, although with "science" taken as a metaphor, not a
...more
Maan Kawas
Sep 21, 2014 rated it really liked it
A beautiful dialogue by the great Ancient Greek philosopher, Plato, which basically deals with definition temperance (in Greek: Sophrosyne)! I particularly loved the idea of self-knowledge, knowing what one knows and what one does not know. Furthermore, I loved the discussion on the relation between medicine and science. The dialogue did not reach a precise definition of temperance, but it raised various important question, which makes it an interesting and enjoyable philosophical work.
Sookie
I am not sure which part of this dialogue was one man hitting on other with blatant homosexual innuendos and which part was part of philosophical discussion.

Or if one was metaphor for the other (you will know which is which), I missed it.
Maxfield
Dec 20, 2011 rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philosophy
Plato's Socrates is a pain in the ass as usual. The ending lets you wonder whether he's about to take fair Charmides to his bed-chamber.
Will
Mar 17, 2016 rated it it was amazing  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philosophy
Can there be any greater enjoyment than reading Plato?
Realini
Jun 20, 2014 rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Charmides by Plato
About Wisdom

Like most of the other dialogues, this one is also beautiful.
To read about wisdom, virtue, good, valor and he most important human qualities is in itself a joy.
Diderot has said that
“A superior mind profits from a page of Plato more than from a thousand pages of critique…
Plato talks about the general harmony of the universe in such a way, that the Almighty Himself would borrow his language and ideas…”
In other words, instead of reading this note of mine here, you ar
...more
Jason
Sep 24, 2013 rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
The Platonic dialogues are called such because they are just that...dialogues. Usually with Socrates and one or two other voices attempting to answer a particular question, what is temperance or wisdom in this case. The brilliance of Plato is that he never answers the questions that he raises. There are layers to his dialogue. The dialogue that is recorded is not the important dialogue that Plato is concerned with...it is the dialogue between the reader and the text in which Plato finds his geni ...more
Averill
Nov 07, 2012 rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philosophy
Once you get thru the blatant homosexual intro it's an ok read. Socrates doesn't seem to get very far with the idea of temperance, but I don't think that was the point. The whole thing may have just been Socrates macking on some young guy.
Chris Bush
Sep 22, 2014 rated it it was amazing  ·  review of another edition
This is not a work to be read only once, or with your mind asleep. I am currently rereading it by section, and rewriting it in my own words.
Steven Untalan
Mar 10, 2014 rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
A quick read that was both engaging and thought provoking.
Melika Khoshnezhad
معني سوفرون خويشتن داري نيست!
ROC

Like most of Plato's dialogues, the Charmides is named after one of the characters who features predominantly in it. In this dialogue Socrates tell us how he met Charmides, a young man famous for his charm and devastating good looks. He tells us, that at the time of meeting Charmides he had just returned from a military campaign and started a discussion about two of his favourite subjects: philosophy, and handsome young men. Critias says that Socrates is in luck, here comes the most beautiful yo

...more
Jairo Fraga
Couldn't find this dialogue translated into portuguese, so I read an english one.

I'm once again puzzled with the often presented praises on the young boys "beauty", which makes some dialogues a bit silly (I can't imagine serious conversations nowadays focusing on a boy stature and beautiful face).

Nonetheless, the dialogue continues with an interesting question, about temperance, and what it means. As it happens on some other dialogues, it ends without a proper answer, only contributing to the pr
...more
Marco Pontual
Dec 20, 2016 rated it it was ok  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: philo
Kind of interesting, albeit full of sophisms from Plato. Charmides says one thing, Socrates goes on and refutes a scarecrow argument.

They say this is part of the early writings of Plato, hence the weaker argumentation. Apparently he was also trying to portrait Socrates' relations with Critias as one by which Socrates was trying to make Critias a better person, so that the accusations that Socrates was a friend of Critias (who later became one of the thirty tyrants) was partially explained.
Trounin
В Древней Греции практиковалось хорошо помогающее лечебное средство — заговоры. Считалось, что боль можно заговорить. Вот с этим-то лучше всех прочих и могли справиться софисты. От чего обычно приходит мучение, на самом деле приносит облегчение. Стоит тогда попробовать обратиться за помощью к Сократу, вот где верное средство от головной боли для его современников, но и причина оной для потомков.

(c) Trounin
Nuska
Aug 01, 2017 rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: 2017
Sócrates vuelve a narrar este diálogo en el que se encuentra con Cármides y, tras la alabanza de todas sus cualidades, tanto físicas como intelectuales, discuten acerca del sentido de la sensatez, pasando al del conocimiento, sus límites y a la misma filosofía.
Sol
Sep 23, 2017 rated it it was ok  ·  review of another edition
Hah, GAAAAAY.
Ben Marcher
Did not find this particularly insightful
Thiago Naves
Mar 21, 2017 rated it it was amazing  ·  review of another edition
Confusing and kind of vague, but it still is fun seeing Socrates turn people's minds, a great example of the effectiveness of his method.
Mary Kelly
A little convoluted and some of the arguments are simply ridiculous, but he has some fun and Socrates even flirts a bit with Charmides.
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  • Cyclops
  • The Categories
  • Plato: A Very Short Introduction
  • On Great Writing (On the Sublime)
  • Outlines of Scepticism
  • Fragments
  • Indian Philosophy: A Very Short Introduction
  • Presocratic Philosophy: A Very Short Introduction
  • Four Texts on Socrates: Euthyphro/Apology/Crito/Aristophanes' Clouds
  • The Discourses
  • L'arte di invecchiare
  • Persecution and the Art of Writing
  • Proslogion
  • The Seven Against Thebes
  • Lettera sulla felicità
879
(Greek: Πλάτων) (Arabic: أفلاطون) (Alternate Spelling: Platón, Platone)
Plato is a Classical Greek philosopher, mathematician, student of Socrates, writer of philosophical dialogues, and founder of the Academy in Athens, the first institution of higher learning in the Western world. Along with his mentor, Socrates, and his student, Aristotle, Plato helped to lay the foundations of Western philosoph
...more
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“Modesty is becoming in youth.” 1 likes
“El alma es la que debe ocupar nuestros primeros cuidados, y los más asiduos, si queremos que la cabeza y el cuerpo entero estén en buen estado.” 0 likes
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