So what are your final thoughts about A Fire Upon the Deep? Anything you want to say that hasn't been said?

This is also a good place for anyone to post their reviews of A Fire Upon the Deep. Copy and paste it here or give us a link to your review. It should be another fine way to generate discussions.

I finished this book several days ago but didn't have time to write my review until this morning.

Here's the link to the review: http://www.goodreads.com/review/show/410...

Compared with the other space opera stories I've read lately, this one came in at the bottom unfortunately. Old Man's War was the best of the 4-5 books in that subgenre that I've read very recently.

I really liked to hear how you focused on Johanna and Jefri in your reading of A Fire Upon the Deep. I found myself more interested in the Tines that they came in contact with, so it is interesting to read how others approached the novel. I am going to go add Old Man's War on your recommendation, you wouldn't be able to mooch it my way even though I live in Canada, would you, Jon?

Brad wrote: "I really liked to hear how you focused on Johanna and Jefri in your reading of [b:A Fire Upon the Deep|77711|A Fire Upon The Deep (Zones of Thought)|Vernor Vinge|http://photo.goodreads.com/books/11..."

I can make an exception for Canadians. :)

I haven't posted it for mooching yet. I haven't decided if I want to part with it yet. I liked it a lot. When I do post it, I'll reserve it and let you know.

@Brad

I goofed! I double-checked my shelves (i.e. how I categorize the books I read) and Old Man's War wasn't on my space-opera shelf. So, sorry about the miscommunication and my faulty memory. It's still a great book.

So, back pedaling a bit, the best space opera I've read recently would have to be On Basilisk Station which I already re-mooched.

Haha, differences make the world go round. I loved Fire Upon THe Deep, and found On Basilik Station a bit mundane.

I'm very glad I was introduced to it. I'd never read Vinge before so this was all new to me. I actually enjoyed it so much I want to go read the prequel and the upcoming (hopefully) sequel!

Whitaker wrote: "I'm very glad I was introduced to it. I'd never read Vinge before so this was all new to me. I actually enjoyed it so much I want to go read the prequel and the upcoming (hopefully) sequel! "

I feel the same way. Great space opera is more than weird aliens blowing up stuff and getting blown up. This was a lot of fun but still a challenging read.

I thought there was a lot of good stuff in this book: the zones, a fresh take on group-think, well-managed parallel narratives, plenty of ethical quandaries, great characters (among the Tines, that is.) However, I never really developed an emotional connection with the main conflict. This meant that the more than 600 pages seemed much longer.

I'm a bit split myself, like Thomas I imagine. There was much to admire in A Fire Upon the Deep, and I look forward to the prequel and potential sequel, but there I really only connected emotionally with half the book. I never got bored, but I also never really cared about Ravna and the Riders, although I was fascinated by Pham, which makes the prequel an enticing book since it tracks Pham's early years, from what I understand.

I'll jump on to the ambivalent band wagon. Thomas does a good job covering the strengths. I even like Ravna, Pham and the Riders at first, but I lost most of this connection as things went on.


**** Spoilers *****

There seemed to be less character development than dissolution. Also, it never made sense to me how Pham became in charge on the ship. Ravna was initially competent and seemed to have the best understanding of contemporary universe and of Powers, until she set foot on the ship. The Riders probably had the most extensive experience of other species and cultures not to mention the best understanding the ship. But, they were already deferring to Pham before their was any question about their independence from the Blight. And, it wasn't just when there was "God Chatter," which seemed to be at identifiable times.

Anyway, overall I think On Basilik Station was more fun but ultimately less interesting in terms of ideas.

JuliAnna wrote: "Also, it never made sense to me how Pham became in charge on the ship. Ravna was initially competent and seemed to have the best understanding of contemporary universe and of Powers, until she set foot on the ship. The Riders probably had the most extensive experience of other species and cultures not to mention the best understanding the ship...."

Interesting point, JuliAnna. I wonder why I never thought to question Pham's sudden authority. I know Vinge was careful to say that Pham had changed security and tampered with system functions, and the Riders always seemed to be fairly passive beings. But Ravna is a different story. She could have done more to undermine Pham, or even used her sexuality to trick him, but then she is a librarian and not necessarily a girl of action, so stalemate is a somewhat logical outcome of her resistance to Pham. I am definitely going to be looking at this the next time I read A Fire Upon the Deep. You're the second person to recommend On Basilisk Station. I think I am going to have to grab it.

Pham's taking control of the ship and of the situation was a logical extension of their physical descent toward the slow zone. His particular skills and personal history were best suited to handle the challenges they were facing. Also, I don't recall the riders really deferring to Pham until after harmonious repose, at which point he did not allow Blueshell to retain control of the ship.

I got my time line crossed up then, Wes. For some reason I had it in my head that Pham had already made significant changes to protocol and security before Harmonious Repose and that Blueshell knew it was going on and just let it go. Oops.

"Also, it never made sense to me how Pham became in charge on the ship" mostly due the the strength of his character and more importantly the godshatter, he was a transcendent being stuff ina human body.

THe Tines have got to be one of the best realized aliens I've read. The biological counterpoint point to the (then) emerging abilities of parallel computing was way way ahead of its time. Vinge did a great job of ratcheting up and down the tension throughout the book. Characters were moderately well written and kept true to their personalities.

Though great this book isn't nearly as awesome as his newer work Rainbow Sky.

For those of you that haven't yet picked up the "prequel" — A Deepness in the Sky — I can strongly recommend it. I think it actually is the better book, which shouldn't be surprising, since it was published eight years later.

In terms of plot, it is a surprisingly similar book: a space opera in which technological advanced civilizations are fighting over first-contact with a (relatively) technologically primitive world, at the same time that fought-over world is racing to the climax of a conflict of its own. Also, adorable alien children play significant roles in both :-) (Actually, in Deepness Vinge got better at making them realistically appealing, instead of just manipulating his audience by putting the kids in peril).

A few more details can be found at my review.

Agree. A Deepness in the Sky reflects a maturing of Vinge's skill. However, the alien species in both books are well thought out with critical differences from humans which, of course, the humans don't initially get.

I have had so many other things to read I forgot that this was something I was planning on reading too. Thanks for the reminder.