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Practical Pagan > Earthgazing: archaeology or geology...

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message 1: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments An unusual white stone circle was discovered early this year in a remote area of British Columbia. Scientists say that although it resembles stone circles made by humans it's a geological feature. You can see it on Google Earth.

Archaeology or geology - what do you think?


message 2: by [deleted user] (new)

I'm going to sit in the middle with this one. Very likely geological, possibly archaeological? It is very distinct from space isn't it?

I thought this added comment by Andrew Okulitch, is interesting :

"The land surface is a bit lumpy and there is a gully just north of the circle but it is straight, not internally or externally concentric to the stone circle. There are no pits or ditches, or any features that might suggest anything man-made. The small excavations we made indicated to us that the stones were deposited on top of glacially-derived soils and that only moderate down-hill flow of soft wet soils has occurred since.

I presume that you are seeking any evidence for human influence so I would remind you that making such a circle or anything else would require considerable infrastructure such as a large population from which hundreds of workers could be drawn, provision of food and shelter, construction of roads, rollers and ropes, all in an area with relatively few resources for any of these things."

I'm interested to see what follows.


message 3: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments I love mysterious findings like these. I'm inclined to accept what the geologists say, but there's always a small voice saying that maybe they're wrong. I wonder if we'll hear anything more about it.

The circle reminds me of the Nasca Lines - possibly if they'd been more abstract, geologists would have classified them as naturally formed.


message 4: by [deleted user] (new)

Dead Mars, Dying Earth Dead Mars, Dying Earth In this book, they speak of strange structures on Mars. I'm open to ideas. I think human knowledge is tiny in comparison to the mysteries that surround us.

Another interesting book, in terms of strange structures: Chariots of the GodsChariots of the Gods The author writes in a very sixties way (many interesting ideas, little physical research), but I love the questions he raises.


message 5: by [deleted user] (new)

Chariots of the Gods speaks of the Nasca lines too. Interestingly enough both Sagan and Einstein, voiced their belief that earth may have been visited by extra-terrestrial beings at an early period in our history. I think our early Gods were very ungod-like, and our evolutionary leaps were unaccountably huge.


message 6: by Nell, Moderator (last edited May 11, 2012 06:55AM) (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments Georgina wrote: "...our evolutionary leaps were unaccountably huge. "

I've recently read an almost exactly similar statement - I think it was in:
The Cosmic Serpent  DNA and the Origins of Knowledge The Cosmic Serpent: DNA and the Origins of Knowledge


message 7: by Kori (last edited May 11, 2012 11:36AM) (new)

Kori (Bad_Apple) | 13 comments There was a National Geographic's documentary about UFOs in various world religions. And I remember one segment was devoted to this wall archaeologists found that couldn't be explained - the bricks were too smooth to be man made, but machines of that capability were centuries away from invention.

This kind of reminds of that - an unexplained structure.

The same documentary also mentioned math and the pyramids. According to records, for the pyramids to have been built in the time frame recorded a block would have to be placed approximately every ten minutes. So there must have been tools or a technique we are unaware of that were used to construct the pyramids.

So maybe these stone circles were built by humans, but in a way we don't usually see (like for cultural reasons).


message 8: by [deleted user] (new)

Thanks, Nell, added to my TR list. It doesn't come in a kindle edition unfortunately, but I'll see if I can track down a paperback copy, close by.

Wish I could have seen that documentary, Kori. The more we discover, the more the mysteries deepen. The pyramids are a good point.

My friends know me as an out-there hippy. I've long found these questions fascinating. Now Mars is interesting. It suffered from a catastrophic ground water release. I've unnerved people by questioning whether the flood and the ark, actually relate to earth at all. Not saying I believe, I just think that in order to find answers we have to open our minds to possibilities. It seems now-a-days people pride themselves on being skeptics. But the can't see it before my eyes, so it doesn't exist, approach, is so limiting. Quantum physics now sums up so many of the hippy ideas of the sixties. What's next?


Neil Hocking | 20 comments Too true Georgina. Skepticism is the chastity of the intellect.


message 10: by [deleted user] (new)

I like how you put that. :)


message 11: by [deleted user] (new)

A quote about skepticism: "Many people feel duty-bound to express skepticism as if it were an automatic badge of honor and intellectual superiority." Jane Roberts


message 12: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments A rather lovely photo of a little spring in Devon called The Druid's Well.

More Here


message 13: by [deleted user] (new)

Beautiful! Sometimes I miss England, especially in my dreams. :)


message 14: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments I came across Carahunge, and thought I'd post a link as it's Solstice today. :)

The language/name connection is especially interesting.


message 15: by [deleted user] (new)

Nell wrote: "I came across Carahunge, and thought I'd post a link as it's Solstice today. :)

The language/name connection is especially interesting."


Wow!!

"Many of these stones have smooth angled holes of 4 to 5cm in diameter, the angles of the holes being directed at different points on the horizon and outer space."


message 16: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments The other amazing thing is that if there is a language connection, that surely means that Stonehenge means 'stone voice' or 'stone sound'. Perhaps the stones rang when struck with the right material - not that anyone will ever be allowed to find out.


Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments Saw a thing on tv a while back discussing the sonic properties of (mainly) Stonehenge and Newgrange.
Stonehenge seemed to amplify sounds at certain points within its area, reflected from the uprights.
When certain low frequency sounds were played in Newgrange the dust "danced" in shapes like the spirals that decorate many neolithic sites.
Can't remember the name of the program though.


message 18: by [deleted user] (new)

Communication points...


message 19: by [deleted user] (new)

Or what?


Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments Remember reading (think in a National Geographic) that Göbekli Tepe in Turkey (near the Syrian border) seems to have helped (possibly caused) the development of agriculture.
Rather than a stable agrarian culture enabling a society to co-ordinate the building of a large "temple" site it's thought that the building of a site like this forced the domestication of plants and livestock to enable feeding the (now settled during the building process) folk that built it.
I'm probably over simplifying this hugely as I read it a while ago.
This seems to suggest a drive to produce these large sites before complex settled societies existed.


message 21: by [deleted user] (new)

"...the building of a site like this forced the domestication of plants and livestock to enable feeding the (now settled during the building process) folk that built it..."

Low range sounds, that's subliminal?


Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments Seem to remember they did some "generated" low frequency noise, non-audible. But also looked at instruments and how bass noise caused dust motes to "dance".
Have looked on youtube but can't find a link.
If I find one I'll post it.


message 23: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments Old-Barbarossa wrote: "Saw a thing on tv a while back discussing the sonic properties of (mainly) Stonehenge and Newgrange.
Stonehenge seemed to amplify sounds at certain points within its area, reflected from the uprights.
When certain low frequency sounds were played in Newgrange the dust "danced" in shapes like the spirals that decorate many neolithic sites.
Can't remember the name of the program though.
"


The dancing spirals sound magical. I seem to remember seeing something about sound waves creating patterns in granular material on a flat surface, but nothing about the same effect occurring in the air. The whole subject is fascinating - it would be great if you could find a link.


message 24: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments Earplugs needed...

Cymatics.


message 25: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments And there's an interesting discussion about the subject Here.


message 26: by [deleted user] (new)

Yes, very magical! And I have too ("I seem to remember seeing something about sound waves creating patterns in granular material on a flat surface..")

Stone Voice indeed.

And the holes aligned with the stars...

Looking at those links...


message 27: by Nell, Moderator (last edited Jun 22, 2012 05:03AM) (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments I found a link to the programme Here.

And more links and discussion Here.

And links to sounds from other circles Here

I'll watch it later - must walk the small furry one now...

Edited to add that there's a piracy warning on the download, so it's unavailable...:(


Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments Excuse my poor memory, but I again seem to remember but can't cite the source, the Cymatics patterns have been claimed to match decorations within Roslyn Chapel.
Some theory about a hidden musical notation within the chapel architecture.
So the Templars were hiding the secret of "the lost chord"!


message 29: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments It just keeps getting better and better...:)


message 30: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments An interesting and bizarre find in Cambridgeshire, England - a woman buried with a cow. They say she must have been incredibly well-respected for such a valuable food source to be sacrificed. Read about it at Megalithic Portal Here.


message 31: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments Another strange find...

'Frankenstein' bog bodies discovered.

Perhaps it's simpler than the archaeologists surmise. Maybe the people who placed the separate parts together found them in the peat (missing some parts/other bodies) and reburied them respectfully without realizing that they didn't match.


message 32: by [deleted user] (new)

Yes, that makes more sense.


Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0729/reek...

There are still old gods there...
Mwah-ha-ha!
Fools!
They will provide sustenance to Crom Cruach, he will devour their souls, grow fat on their toil, gain power from their pain!
Pop---tongue from cheek.

As it turns out the geography still plays a part in ritual out here, although the 20k pilgrims turned out to be about 12k. Some doing it bare footed...and the last 1/4 or so is mainly scree at a 45 degree angle...that'll be the penance for you then.
The view from the top is spectacular (on a good day) and it looks like a pyramid on the approach from the East.
Not sure of the archeology, but it would be an obvious ritual site well before Patrick told the snakes to bugger off.


message 34: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments Old-Barbarossa wrote: "http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0729/reek...

There are still old gods there...
Mwah-ha-ha!
Fools!
They will provide sustenance to Crom Cruach, he will devour their souls, grow fat on the..."


Ha...

Here's what wiki says about the Reek Pilgrimage.

All those people tramping over the land together - any spirituality will be inaccessible. I'd go, but alone, and not for St Patrick, who had no right to mess with the snakes...


Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments Hiving hiked around many hills over the years and occasionaly been told "don't worry there's a pub a the top" as an incentive (there never was...a hip flask maybe, but never a pub) I have to say I was a little taken aback when on my first wander up the reek years back I discovered a kirk...I'd been told there was one there but took this info with the pinch of salt the pub promise had earned. Also 1st time up there was a monk in a tent at the top doing the retreat thing.


message 36: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments As they tended to build churches on previously sacred sites in order to Christianize them, that seems to reinforce wiki's statement that " In reality, the modern pilgrimage is a long-Christianised variation of a ritual that dates back to pre-Christian, pagan Celtic Ireland, celebrating the festival of Lughnasadh."

Still, as they've already pilled, it'll all be clear for Pagans tomorrow :)


message 37: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments The creator of a mysterious magic underwater circle revealed!

(Not exactly archaeology or geology, but rather lovely all the same :))


message 38: by Aaron, Moderator (last edited Sep 25, 2012 10:31AM) (new)

Aaron Carson | 718 comments Now Mars is interesting. It suffered from a catastrophic ground water release.

What do we think about the alleged cat face found on the surface of mars photographed by the fly-by? There was some speculation about it being a mirror to the sphinx in Egypt. It being supposedly pointed to, by the pyramids.


message 39: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments I seem to remember that it was said by experts (geologists?) to be a natural feature and that the 'face-effect' was simply an illusion created by shadows. I think I saw a digital video construction (made from contour data) of what it would look like if one could fly low over and around it. There seem to be small pyramid-shaped objects somewhere not far away too. I'm on the fence with that one - what do you think?


message 40: by Aaron, Moderator (new)

Aaron Carson | 718 comments I'm afraid I have Neptune square sun, and Mercury in Pisces in the first house, so I'm always ready to swallow any idea if it's mystical enough. That said, I like a certain amount of logical complexity, in my magical notions, but it doesn't have to be too too solid.

I love the idea of a cat face on mars watching us eternally and possibly thinking to itself in a smug, feline sort of way, "What a bunch of nig-nogs".


message 41: by Aaron, Moderator (new)

Aaron Carson | 718 comments That said, I believe, (in a piscean sort of way,) that an "effect" can be mystical in itself, even if caused by shadows or mirrors.


message 42: by [deleted user] (new)

Fellow Piscean here, Aaron. :) Had to pop in for this one. I'm fascinated by Mars, possible constructions and all. I read an interesting book on it a few years ago: Dead Mars, Dying Earth, that really got me think about possible scenarios.

Considering that they are thinking of terra forming Mars, in some distant future, I think Mars is tied in with our history: past and present. Chunks of Mars have been found on earth from that groundwater explosion.

My wacky idea for you for the day (always good to standout for something, be it madness or ability to entertain out there ideas) is: did the 'flood' happen on earth? and what about that ark?

Personally I'm going with the face is a face, because I think this universe is even more vivid and surreal than we could possibly imagine. :):)


message 43: by Aaron, Moderator (new)

Aaron Carson | 718 comments because I think this universe is even more vivid and surreal than we could possibly imagine. :):) Here here. This is slightly off topic but I wanted to share with you my own whacked out theory. It occurred to me that humans may have once lived on Venus, but we polluted it so badly, that we had to move. That's why why it's covered in poisonous gases. I wish you could have seen my Taurean physicist friend's face when I shared my theory with him. He did his phd on Venus.


message 44: by [deleted user] (new)

That's my take on Mars. Not saying I believe outright, but I entertain. Could we be planet hoppers with a thing for destroying out habitats? How did the human species evolve so rapidly on earth? No other species did. It's not just bone marrow meals making our brains bigger, and tribal living, that accelerated it. What other life forms were in our solar system at that time. The idea that we are alone in this universe is ludicrous. Our knowledge is like that of an ant's when it looks up at sun.

Yes, I can well imagine his expression.:)


message 45: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments Gina wrote: The idea that we are alone in this universe is ludicrous.

I wrote something similar in an essay once and the teacher covered it in red ink. I still believe it.

Less than ants are we, methinks...

Deepest-ever view of the Universe


message 46: by Old-Barbarossa (last edited Sep 27, 2012 04:33AM) (new)

Old-Barbarossa | 309 comments Nell wrote: "Gina wrote: The idea that we are alone in this universe is ludicrous..."

That's as maybe...but we're not the only living thing on this planet either and we can't communicate with any other species here...OK we can tell dogs to sit etc, but we can't discuss maths or engineering or poetry.
My point is that life on other planets, if it exists, needn't be intelligent enough to talk to...or it may be too advanced...or use scent to pass information rather than sound/signs as we do.


message 47: by [deleted user] (new)

Nell wrote: "Gina wrote: The idea that we are alone in this universe is ludicrous.

I wrote something similar in an essay once and the teacher covered it in red ink. I still believe it.

Less than ants are we, ..."


Must have made her feel momentarily better. ;) I like Seth's saying: impose no limits, encounter none.

The deepest-ever view of the universe is beautiful!


message 48: by [deleted user] (new)

Old-Barbarossa wrote: "Nell wrote: "Gina wrote: The idea that we are alone in this universe is ludicrous..."

That's as maybe...but we're not the only living thing on this planet either and we can't communicate with any ..."


Very good point. The way we judge and measure intelligence is flawed too.


message 49: by Nell, Moderator (new)

Nell Grey (nellgrey) | 1563 comments I think it's true that very few people have actually tried in a serious way to communicate with the other animals on Earth. There was a chimpanzee once who was brought up as a human child and taught sign language. She was eventually returned to Africa where she lived in some sort of sanctuary with others of her kind. Years later she communicated with a visitor (I think it must have been someone she'd known before), who was able to understand her. She signed 'Help me'.

Then there was the scientist who worked with an African Grey called Alex for most - if not all - of the parrot's life. She wrote about it in Alex & Me: How a Scientist and a Parrot Discovered a Hidden World of Animal Intelligence--and Formed a Deep Bond in the Process.

OK, so it's not maths, engineering or poetry, but worth mentioning...


message 50: by Aaron, Moderator (new)

Aaron Carson | 718 comments I find cats very easy to understand, but there is a definite theme to their conversation. "Don't look at me", "don't touch the hair," "I'm not in the mood," "Is this the best you can do?", (when presented with their meal), "scratch lower, okay you can go now, we're done."

There was some comedian who said that if aliens came to earth, based on our behaviour, they would assume that cats and dogs we're running the earth, and we were enslaved to them.


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