Goodreads Librarians Group discussion

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Amazon is going away as a data source

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message 701: by Brian (new)

Brian (bmpercy) | 62 comments Carolyn wrote: "Mayanka, can you give us a timeframe for when the librarian attributed edits 'update' will be complete?
I've got over 700 books on my Rescue Me shelf, and I've done thousands of edits. I figure I'..."


Carolyn, as indicated in another thread (http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/7...), the librarian edits 'update' is (mostly) complete now. You should probably go ahead.

There are a few more books that need to be reprocessed because my script skipped their edits, but it shouldn't be a huge number of books affected.

If any of you don't know what I'm referring to, you can read the other thread, or you can just get back to rescuing your books. A few librarians were waiting for this script to complete in case it ended up rescuing a few of the books they would've otherwise been rescuing.

Thanks everyone for all your help so far! :)


message 702: by Dionisia (new)

Dionisia (therabidreader) | 19 comments Question/suggestion....For books not covered by the database import and not rescued by a librarian, will they maintain the same Book ID once the rest of the book's data is removed??

If so, then that would be a good way to identify a book on your shelf with no title or author listed. If a member exports their books, then the export file can be used later as a reference. To my knowledge, all books have a unique Goodreads book ID. Search for the ID # in the file and then a user will be able to see what title and author used to be attached to it. I hope that made sense! Would this work??


message 703: by Maria M. (new)

Maria M. Elmvang (Kiwiria) | 72 comments Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "While you're at it, Rivka, you might suggest to Otis a site-wide announcement later this week (Thursday?) so that everyone, including those not subscribed to the librarian group, knows what has hap..."

I agree. You're going to have a lot of people very angry with Goodreads (and for good reason too!) if this isn't made public in a proper way.

I can understand why GR hasn't told the general public yet (mass panic before the 14mill load has even completed), but I'd find it very, very reprehensible behaviour indeed if no announcement is made later this week.


message 704: by Helen (new)

Helen | 68 comments Jeannette wrote: "Helen wrote: "Basically, get your book off the shelf, put in the isbn, hit the rescue button and fill ou the boxes. I've had 100s that were not on my list. So far, I've put in about 10 hours sortin..."

If you don't have the actual book then you can look for it on suggested websites. I am currently only dealing with physical books I own whether read or not. Then I'll shift to my e-books although I noticed 2 of my kindles are okay now.

TBR that I don't have, well, perhaps I won't read them ;)


message 705: by Petra X (new)

Petra X (PetraX) What I am doing with books that I am afraid might disappear, is putting the isbn and/or title in private notes, that way I will have a record that didn't take too long to set up. I might do this for books where I really care about the edition as well, but right now I am 'rescuing' all the books on my rescue list that have only 1 rating.


message 706: by Patrick (new)

Patrick Brown | 102 comments Mod
Eva wrote: "Would it not make sense to send an email or update to all authors instead of burying this info in a post? I just happened to see the "please rescue this book" on one of my titles. Had I not logged ..."

This is in the works. We've got a lot on our plate at the moment, but we're hoping to get an email sent soon.


message 707: by Sara ♥ (new)

Sara ♥ (saranicole) | 317 comments Maria wrote: "Actually I'm kinda having fun with it :)"

I sorta am, too... Of course, I think that has a lot to do with the total number you start out with. I had under 200, so it's not as daunting some of you guys! I've found quite a few errors that I've been able to correct! Plus, I've added quite a bit of information to some of them (esp. "page" number info for a bunch of my audiobooks).

I really hope GR is able to find good sources for your non-English books soon! I feel so bad for you guys as it stands now! Don't give up though—I can tell from what TPTB have been saying that they're trying really hard to fix this out! Don't let The Man (Amazon) tear us apart!!! That's what they want!!

I hope GR is as


message 708: by Sara ♥ (new)

Sara ♥ (saranicole) | 317 comments Nickname wrote: "I find this book in the rescue list

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/10...

But it's not related with Amazon."


I went in and changed the language code to be blank and saved, then changed it back to Italian and saved it. No more Amazon!


message 709: by Carolyn (new)

Carolyn (seeford) | 577 comments Brian wrote: "Carolyn, as indicated in another thread (http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/7763...), the librarian edits 'update' is (mostly) complete now. You should probably go ahead."

Thanks Brian!
I hadn't seen that other thread, but I have been monitoring this one. Appreciate the heads-up and I'll start working through mine now.


message 710: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
Ok, what did I forget from the FAQ thread? I'm sure theres quite a bit.


message 711: by Lee (last edited Jan 24, 2012 10:19AM) (new)

Lee Broderick | 22 comments Brian wrote: Carolyn, as indicated in another thread (http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/7763...), the librarian edits 'update' is (mostly) complete now. You should probably go ahead.

Crap. I've still got 122 books left to save. Not as bad as some, but still time I could have used more productively.


message 712: by Vicky (new)

Vicky (vnorthw) | 2440 comments rivka wrote: "Ok, what did I forget from the FAQ thread? I'm sure theres quite a bit."

Would a list of all the websites people have been finding to get new data be helpful? I'll scan through the pages and compile it for you to add if you think it would be useful!


message 713: by Jan (new)

Jan (janoda) | 140 comments The big import is still running though right?


message 714: by vicki_girl (new)

vicki_girl | 2764 comments rivka wrote: "Ok, what did I forget from the FAQ thread? I'm sure theres quite a bit."

You might want to add that you don't have to have the URL if you have the book in front of you (physical or ebook copy). Some people are still getting confused by the "Source (required)" as listed on the rescue page.


message 715: by vicki_girl (new)

vicki_girl | 2764 comments Vicky wrote: "rivka wrote: "Ok, what did I forget from the FAQ thread? I'm sure theres quite a bit."

Would a list of all the websites people have been finding to get new data be helpful? I'll scan through the p..."


Seconded.


message 716: by Mel (new)

Mel (Soireb) | 224 comments Here are two websites from Spanish books published in Puerto Rico, some of the books I've read come from these publishers :

Editorial de la Universidad de Puerto Rico
Publicaciones Puertorriqueñas


message 717: by Eva (new)

Eva Dillner (Eva_Dillner) Patrick wrote: "Thanks you all so much for your feedback on this. We knew that posting this information would result in a lot of concern, but we felt the time was right to share what we could. For years, we've use..."

Thanks for this post, it explains what is happening, and feels very reassuring. Personally I'm pleased as punch that Ingrams is the new source.


message 718: by Ellie (new)

Ellie (patchworkbunny) | 3 comments My question about UK ISBNs wasn't really answered (I checked the FAQ too). Will the merged edition still show all possible ISBNs for that book or will it only be searchable by the title/author or the specific ISBN as held in the data service?

The British Library's data service is available free for non-commercial use but am assuming the advertising on Goodreads makes it commercial?


message 719: by John (new)

John Dodds (jcdodds) | 21 comments I'm down to having only 220 books to save now, having started with over 500. The 14 million import is making a big difference. I hope it's got a way still to run!


message 720: by Alessandra (new)

Alessandra | 108 comments Maria wrote: "Jeannette wrote: "I don't see why the title has to be removed."
Apparently, such are the demands that Amazon has put on Goodreads. At least, that's what I gather from the mods' posts in this thread..."


Sounds like Amazon is being ludicrously hard-nosed about this.

I wasn't sure if my total needing rescue was dropping because of the Ingrams upload or because of the diligent work of the GR librarians. It has been dropping at a moderate pace, which suggests to me it's y'all, not Ingrams.

I appreciate all the work everybody's putting into this.


message 721: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
Vicky wrote: "Would a list of all the websites people have been finding to get new data be helpful?"

I'm sure it couldn't hurt.


message 722: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
vicki_girl wrote: "You might want to add that you don't have to have the URL if you have the book in front of you (physical or ebook copy)."

??? I did put that.


message 723: by vicki_girl (new)

vicki_girl | 2764 comments rivka wrote: "vicki_girl wrote: "You might want to add that you don't have to have the URL if you have the book in front of you (physical or ebook copy)."

??? I did put that."



Okay, yeah, it's there. Somehow I missed it the first time. :S


message 724: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
I bolded it now. If you missed it, I bet other people did too.


message 725: by MissSusie (new)

MissSusie | 30 comments Helen wrote: "Jeannette wrote: "Helen wrote: "Basically, get your book off the shelf, put in the isbn, hit the rescue button and fill ou the boxes. I've had 100s that were not on my list. So far, I've put in abo..."

Most of what I have left are books on my TBR list has anyone else noticed books they don't even remember putting on that list?


message 726: by Sarah (Presto agitato) (last edited Jan 24, 2012 11:16AM) (new)

Sarah (Presto agitato) (mg2001) | 46 comments I have a couple of questions, to confirm a few things that have come up.
1) People asked if Google Books is okay as a source, and it seems to be thought that it is, but Google Books now sells ebooks itself. So is it considered an e-commerce site (hence not okay), or a valid source?
2) It was also asked if we can use Amazon cover images if we re-upload them. One answer was that yes, we can, since they are publisher sourced (?) I really would like to make sure, though, before uploading many of them.
3) What are legitimate ways to find descriptions (aside from writing them ourselves)?


message 727: by Alessandra (new)

Alessandra | 108 comments Sarah wrote: "I have a couple of questions, to confirm a few things that have come up.
1) People asked if Google Books is okay as a source, and it seems to be thought that it is, but Google Books now sells ebook..."


Re:#3: Is the back cover copy (or flap copy) of the book acceptable as a description? I hope so, because I've been using it.

This, of course, only works for physical books with descriptive copy.


message 728: by M a y a (new)

M a y a (M-a-y-a) | 63 comments Sarah wrote: "I have a couple of questions, to confirm a few things that have come up.
1) People asked if Google Books is okay as a source, and it seems to be thought that it is, but Google Books now sells ebook..."


#2) No, you must obtain the cover from elsewhere, please. It should come from any trustworthy site that is not a bookseller; the publisher or author's website is best.


message 729: by Maria M. (new)

Maria M. Elmvang (Kiwiria) | 72 comments Alessandra wrote: "Re:#3: Is the back cover copy (or flap copy) of the book acceptable as a description? I hope so, because I've been using it."

A previous comment said that the back/flap blurb was the best way to get a description, so you're golden :)


message 730: by Abraham (new)

Abraham Ray (aberay) | 36 comments how do you put the url from library sites?


message 731: by Moloch (last edited Jan 24, 2012 11:46AM) (new)

Moloch | 1038 comments Mayanka wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I have a couple of questions, to confirm a few things that have come up.
1) People asked if Google Books is okay as a source, and it seems to be thought that it is, but Google Books n..."


This is just a nightmare: I have re-uploaded many of them, they appear with my username as source and have now a URL like this http://photo.goodreads.com/...
Please tell me they're not going to disappear on the 30th


message 732: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
Moloch, I can't follow your link and am confused about your question. Can you please elaborate?


message 733: by Moloch (new)

Moloch | 1038 comments Ok. In some cases I have saved to my hard disk the cover that was already on Goodreads (from Amazon), then reuploaded it. While before they had an URL like this http://execs.amazon.com etc etc or similar, they now have a URL like this: http://photos.goodreads.com etc etc (the link doesn't work, it's just an example). Now are these covers going to disappear?


message 734: by Moloch (new)

Moloch | 1038 comments And in the edit book page it said the cover came from a 3rd party (Amazon), but it doesn't anymore after I reuploaded it.


message 735: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
Thanks for clarifying. As Mayanka said, please get covers from somewhere other than Amazon.

Keep in mind that a book that is rescued can always have a cover added after the deadline. Covers are not nearly as urgent.


message 736: by Otis, Chief Architect (new)

Otis Chandler | 315 comments Mod
Sarah wrote: "I have a couple of questions, to confirm a few things that have come up.
1) People asked if Google Books is okay as a source, and it seems to be thought that it is, but Google Books now sells ebook..."


We don't have an explicit license with Google, so legally any books rescued from them would be at risk down the road. However, if the choice is not finding another source or using Google (Worldcat, publisher, etc come up empty), then it's possible we can negotiate a license down the road.

From: http://www.google.com/accounts/TOS

"8.2 You should be aware that Content presented to you as part of the Services, including but not limited to advertisements in the Services and sponsored Content within the Services may be protected by intellectual property rights which are owned by the sponsors or advertisers who provide that Content to Google (or by other persons or companies on their behalf). You may not modify, rent, lease, loan, sell, distribute or create derivative works based on this Content (either in whole or in part) unless you have been specifically told that you may do so by Google or by the owners of that Content, in a separate agreement."

I don't imagine Content owners (authors & publishers) would ever object to our using their meta-data as we help promote books, but legally the answer to "Can we use Google" should be no.


message 737: by John (last edited Jan 24, 2012 12:04PM) (new)

John | 73 comments Sincere apologies if this has been covered elsewhere ...

I have some audiobooks where the publisher is "Audible, Inc." I had added the ones I've read here with their ASIN's manually, so they should remain as I'm the "source" for them. My question is: how can I add others later, if we're forbidden from using Amazon items? (confused!)


message 738: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
John, if you own a copy of an Audible book, you should be able to add its info from the actual book just as you would from a printed book or an ebook.


message 739: by vicki_girl (new)

vicki_girl | 2764 comments Well, since we can't use google books, should we have a list of accpetable sites (publishers, libraries, etc.) and a list unacceptable sites (amazon, google, abebooks, alibris, etc.)?


message 740: by Helen (new)

Helen | 68 comments I've noticed the efforts of other librarians - authors, titles but no description for instance. So the saving is definitely working.

Q - I'm finding books that are safe but have amazon as a source eg picture or info. isbn 9780141 319131 is an example. SHouldn't this be thrown up as needing some saving?


message 741: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
Helen wrote: "Q - I'm finding books that are safe but have amazon as a source eg picture or info. isbn 9780141 319131 is an example. Shouldn't this be thrown up as needing some saving?"

Right now the focus is on saving book records by the deadline. Rescued books can easily have descriptions, covers, etc. added after the deadline.


message 742: by Ellie (new)

Ellie Loredan (ellieloredan) | 97 comments vicki_girl wrote: "Well, since we can't use google books, should we have a list of accpetable sites (publishers, libraries, etc.) and a list unacceptable sites (amazon, google, abebooks, alibris, etc.)?"

I think that would be great - at least to know which sites NOT to use.


message 743: by Audrey (new)

Audrey (odderie) | 48 comments I'm only speculating here, but perhaps GR only identified those books as "at risk" if the title or author info came from Amazon. Any other fields (such as cover art) that came from Amazon weren't included as "at risk," even though that info will also disappear Jan. 30th. I think I saw somewhere in the really long thread that those non-required fields are considered lower priority and can be filled in after the Amazon sweep. Now, whether anyone will actually remember to fill it in is another question.


message 744: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 24231 comments Mod
Audrey wrote: "I'm only speculating here, but perhaps GR only identified those books as "at risk" if the title or author info came from Amazon."

That is correct.


message 745: by Helen (new)

Helen | 68 comments That's a good point Audrey. I've entered so many of my unread books that I'll have to give up work to read them - lol


message 746: by Vicky (last edited Jan 24, 2012 02:13PM) (new)

Vicky (vnorthw) | 2440 comments For people concerned for or willing to help with international books, I found this list of National Libraries. It has about 50 different libraries listed, so it should be a good resource! :)


rivka wrote: "Vicky wrote: "Would a list of all the websites people have been finding to get new data be helpful?"

I'm sure it couldn't hurt."


Here ya go!

Resources for Finding New Data

National Libraries of the World: http://www.publiclibraries.com/world.htm
Use this site to find non-US libraries, some even have English based sites in addition to the native language, so this would be a good resource for librarians rescuing non-English books.

WorldCat: http://worldcat.org

Danish
http://bibliotek.dk/

Dutch
http://zoeken.bibliotheek.be/
http://www.kbr.be/catalogues/catalogu...
http://www.kb.nl/

English *some may be more Multi-Lingual than others
FictFact: http://www.fictfact.com/
FictionDB: http://www.fictiondb.com/
Internet Speculative Fiction Database: http://www.isfdb.org/
ISBNdb: http://isbndb.com/
Library of Congress Catalog: http://catalog.loc.gov/

English Publishers
http://www.persephonebooks.co.uk

German
German National Library/Deutschen Nationalbibliothek: http://www.d-nb.de/

Italian
Bibliotecha Nazionale Centrale di Roma: http://193.206.215.17/BVE/ricercaBase...
Internet Culturale: http://www.internetculturale.it/openc...

Italian Publishers
http://www.einaudi.it/
http://www.librimondadori.it/web/mond...
http://www.feltrinellieditore.it/
http://www.astrolabio-ubaldini.com/
http://rizzoli.rcslibri.corriere.it/
http://www.adelphi.it
http://www.minimumfax.com/
http://www.elliotedizioni.com
http://www.laterza.it
http://www.guanda.it
http://www.neripozza.it
http://www.polilloeditore.it
http://www.mulino.it
http://www.sellerio.it
http://www.skira.net
http://www.fandango.it
http://www.meridianozero.it
http://www.garzantilibri.it
http://www.iperborea.com
http://www.fanucci.it
(Compilation of Italian Publishers: http://www.goodreads.com/story/show/2...)

Spanish
http://www.mcu.es/webISBN/
http://www.laeditorialupr.com/catalog...
http://www.publicacionespr.com/cgi-bi...

UK
The British Library: http://explore.bl.uk/

Rare, Old & Out of Print Books
http://archive.org (Multi-Lingual)
SC University Libraries Rare Books & Special Collections: http://library.sc.edu/spcoll/rarebook...

Specialty
RPG Game Index: http://index.rpg.net/ (for tabletop RPG gaming books)

Cover Images
http://www.tineye.com/ (Search for images similar to the one you provide)


message 747: by Rose (new)

Rose (Rosepetals1984) | 5 comments Great post Vicky!


message 748: by Ellie (new)

Ellie Loredan (ellieloredan) | 97 comments Vicky wrote: "For people concerned for or willing to help with international books, I found this list of National Libraries. It has about 50 different libraries listed, so it should be a good resource! :)


riv..."


Would you mind posting this list in an extra topic? I think otherwise it will get lost in here. Very good job, btw. Thank you :) !


message 749: by Maria M. (new)

Maria M. Elmvang (Kiwiria) | 72 comments rivka wrote: "Audrey wrote: "I'm only speculating here, but perhaps GR only identified those books as "at risk" if the title or author info came from Amazon."

That is correct."


Rivka, once all this is over, would it be possible to get a list of books missing descriptions and covers so we can go through those as well?


message 750: by Cait (last edited Jan 24, 2012 12:48PM) (new)

Cait (tigercait) | 5005 comments The Logus Magazine Index to Science Fiction is a great source of basic info for old science fiction in English (a lot of which is out of print, sometimes with defunct publishers as well).
http://www.locusmag.com/index/

Bedetheque lists a lot of bandes dessinees (graphic novels) in French.
http://www.bedetheque.com/


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