Since we will be starting The Histories by Herodotus on September 4, 2008; I thought it would be nice to begin anew with a new Off Topic Cafe.

Most of the time conversations here should be tangentially connected to the book; but on this thread our many friends (old and new) are welcome to converse and share insights, information and just beautiful conversation without the fear of any spoilers or other constraints of the Weekly non spoiler Book or Supplemental threads. Also, this is where there can be conversation related to other topics of personal or worldwide interest. All conversation must be respectful of all participants and their different or opposing frames of reference.

Enjoy the new Off-topic cafe.

~Bentley

Hi guys just wanted to say hi. It's me debbook from BN. I forgot I had an account here already. On this site I am bookmagic. Anyway, thanks for the invite, enjoy The Histories. I will probably be around lurking at times, but will join you for the next books.
Deb

Hi there Debbook (Bookmagic); don't feel bad when Oldesq mentioned this as a possible venue; I had forgotten that I had been here before too. Lurk and join in as much as you want. I am still figuring out how to set this up in the best way. But I guess it will be on the job training as we plow ahead.

Happy to have you here in any capacity.

Bentley

Hi guys. This site will take some getting used to! This is my first post so let's see what happens when I hit send. So glad I now have some motivation to buckle down start reading Herodotus.

Hi Timbutu. You did great. As I learn about setting up the site, I am sure that things will be clearer. We do not have the editing tools, but it uses the old html tags fine and it is not too bad. It has taken me a day or two to try to figure things out. But I do not think that it is too bad.

It works. I may have to tweak the syllabus a bit since we are just getting officially started but don't worry we have time.

I feel the same way about Herodotus and I am glad that Oldesq made this suggestion.

Bentley

Greetings!
I'm very pleased to have this new venue. Thanks Oldesq and Bentley!
DebbieM

Welcome and thank you for joining us!

Welcome Debbie. This book is going to be challenge and I'm grateful for your help!

Yes, hello to everybody; I think it will be a challenge but I know we can get through it. And we have a good group to begin it with. Welcome Debbie; thinking of you on that sailboat.

Glad that everybody has figured out how to post in this new forum. At least for me it was a little confusing figuring out how to start setting it up.

I think I have gotten the hang of it now and will try to move over the posts and threads that have been posted by anybody in this group on B&N so that we have the Churchill history as well. This will take some time; but I think I can get this done eventually. I will not be transferring anybody's posts who are not part of this group.

Bentley

Folks,

Tomorrow, Oldesq will be manning the discussion board while I am doing a 10K.

Got to take some time off.

Will work on getting everything over; but I think it will take a few weeks; but we have already started a great work of history and I have learned a great deal already.

The Histories is so tangentially connected to so many ideas and areas of knowledge that haven't been discussed by many of us for years. So this will be an interesting journey.

Bentley

A sound mind in a sound body ... you go Bentley!

Thanks Vanessa; I smiled when I saw your note; I am one tired pup; but the weather was absolutely beautiful today and I enjoyed myself.

It was a good day.

Bentley

Glad you made it! I rode my bike 25 miles, it was beautiful here as well. Sometimes a person just has to stop reading!

Vanessa,

Exactly. Glad you had a good day too. Reading is great; but lack of exercise is not.

You have to strike a balance.

The weather could not have been better; glad it was for you too.

Bentley

Sounds like it was a great race day Bentley. There is something wonderful about training and completing a race.

Folks, all of the potential reading list has been entered. There are two lists now; additionally all books are in the bookshelves.

Look under Policies for info.

Bentley

Thank you for all your hard work Bentley.

Oldesq

Welcome.

Ditto! Bravo!

Thank you too Vanessa.

Bentley, that quote you posted from Mother Theresa brought tears to my eyes. So beautiful!

I think she had some beautiful quotes; you are welcome.

I was just playing around with the site and looked at something they called listopia and there was your name beside a list and two other members from the group. So I clicked on one of the members name to see what it was about and before my eyes goodreads said that it sent a note asking for them to vote on which classics they liked best. Yikes. I guess not the most horrible thing to happen; but it was not my intention. Sorry in advance.

If I happened to click on any of you, I apologize..who thought that a note was going to generated post haste. So be forewared: be careful what you click on to be curious. You might be sending a note to somebody.

BTW: which Mother Theresa quote was it; I have a few of hers listed. Was it the one that ended: "For you see, in the end, it is between you and God. It was never between you and them anyway." - loved that one. How all of us get so wrapped up in minutia and what others think or do.

Bentley

Vanessa (Timbuktu)..you know some of these quotes are so applicable..I was looking at some of Eleanor Roosevelt's quotes and was amazed at how some of these quotes are so often used in every day speeches.

I have to say that some of the quotes affected me the same way as they did you. Short, sweet and right on target.

So many of us think too much, worry too much, work too much; that we really do not have enough time to sit, relax, not think and just be in the present moment.

Bentley

Yes, Bentley, that was the quote.

I have to say I often get lost on this site. I never understood how "web design" could be a career but now I get it! LOL!

It is quite a good one for web developers. I thought that it might have been.

Hello All,

In NYC all day (business and pleasure)..glad things carried on. Hope everyone is having a great weekend.

Have guests this weekend so tough to get on as much.

Bentley

Folks, the My Early Life Glossary has been moved over now. Only members who are in the group have had their posts moved over.
That move is complete.

Bentley

Folks, the final syllabi for the completed MY EARLY LIFE DISCUSSION has been moved over. I am only moving over the final one.

Bentley

Folks, I will be starting to bring over the weekly threads which may take me a little time and then I will start bringing over the supplemental threads. (My Early Life)

Bentley

Folks, the last two weekly threads of My Early Life discussions have been moved over. (Week 7 and Week 8) I will be starting to move over Week 6.

Bentley

When I am moving over archival info; I will not move over anybody's posts who is not in this group. So if there are some disconnects in the thought process or flow, that is the reason.

I am just starting week six; and am going from present to past in adding them.

There may be some segments which I have to delete because of the above. It is also tedious to do so I will do this as I have time and inclination; but I will try to keep it going and keep you informed.

Just as an FYI in advance:

Bentley

I just found this link about new info on churchill
Hope it works

http://link.brightcove.con/services/link...

One other thing about archival information that is being brought over; persons names or handles not in this group are deleted as well; even though everything that is posted on that site is an RSS stream and you can google any of your posts or anybody else's on the internet; I would prefer not posting this info unless it appears as a quote in another's post. We will use our discretion and try to bring over what we can that is the creation of the current groups' members. But that will be all. If anything is brought over in error; please point it out and we will promptly delete that portion.

Bentley

Folks,

I will be at a 10K tomorrow for a portion of the day; Oldesq will be looking in.

Bentley

Wow, good for you Bentley!

BTW, just wanted to mention that I've been listening to some other TC tapes, can't remember which as they're all mixed up on my IPod.
One of them mentioned that the Peloponesian War was the equivalent of a world war to the Greeks. They foresaw the end of their civilization. I thought that might have given H an impetus, right there, to want to preserve the history of his people and all the glories that might be lost forever.

Thx. Need the outdoor exercise.

It sounds like the First and Second World War in miniature. You could be on to something Vanessa; but he claims that he was interested in giving the rationale for the Persian Wars which came earlier; but then again in terms of the Peloponnesian Wars; the Persians once again were involved throwing their lot in with the Spartans. Thucydides took up where H left off.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peloponnesi...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Persi...

The following link I call the opposing view: there is a lot on this link and this guy is not H's friend; was a link at the bottom of the Greco-Persian War url on wikepedia. I will have to poke around when I have more time; but the views are certainly "strong" in all areas. Interesting to see how others think.

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/histo...

AND

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/artic...

BTW: the above site was a yahoo pick and an nbc pick and won some awards; it does have some interesting photos, etc. Like I said, some of the opinions are controversial and strong and H wasn't doing well with Professor Stecchini (deceased).

Livio Catullo Stecchini
Livio Catullo Stecchini was a historian of science, a teaching professor (Harvard PhD), a scholar of ancient weights and measures, (the science of metrology) and of the history of cartography in antiquity; (6 October 1913 – Sepember 1979)

Thanks for the great info.

Welcome.

Response to message 36. I, too, have read that Vanessa and with the numerous warring factions, the level of involvement and the vast expanses (compared to the known world) and the development of communication I can imagine that it must have seemed a "war to end all wars."

Yes, Bentley, thanks for the interesting links. That is another issue with the information we have about these times on the Internet. It seems so available but I feel overwhelmed by the amount and trying to discern the quality.

RUINS WHICH MAY HAVE BEEN A MYTH:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080920/ap_o...

Thanks Bentley!!! Fascinating. My father used had a hunch that he was descended from these people. His family is very slavic looking, almond shaped eyes, but blue. I know that's not much to go on but the more I learn about these people the more possible it seems. I'm going to forward the article to a someone who gave a lecture on this.

Oldesq

About the Van Eyck painting..

I told my husband that the woman was not pregnant after all. He's been teaching art for 34 years at a university but had not heard of this. He wanted me to ask you where you heard this? He did a little research on line and traced the theory to a prof in California but he thinks the evidence is weak. There is a statue of St. Margaret in the background which is the saint a woman prays to for an easy labor so he thinks that's a strong hint that the woman is in fact pregnant. Was your source this prof in California? He's going to check with the art historian at the university, he's a studio art prof but often teaches history courses as well.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give.

I heard that information from sources long, long ago. When my children were younger I used to be a volunteer docent for a program that brought faithful reproductions to school children for discussion. There was usually a theme that the paintings shared. We did the van Eyck painting and a Vermeer together at one time. I did reasearch at the time to prepare- the kids always asked such exhilirating questions <g> but the research was done pre Internet and I don't have the source materials.

Oh, Ok. I thought it must be new information. I'm curious to see what he finds out, I'll let you know if anything good turns up.

Response to 47

Vanessa,

Here is a link to the type of scholarship that I was talking about questioning whether the female figure in van Eyck's Arnolfini Bethrothal was pregnant. The writer compared the shape of the figure to the stylized form of dress used for virgin saints at the same time in Flemish painting. I found the discussion quite persuasive.

http://www.escholarship.org/editions/vie...

See the discussion starting at page 104 and especially plate 48.

Do let us know if we have been led astray. <g>

Thanks so much Oldesq. I'll show it to my husband.

Just and FYI:

Folks, just an update on the moving of archival material; it is very time consuming; I am trying to clean it up a bit and not bring over all of the quotes upon embedded quotes; just bringing over the responses and posts. I think it will make it clearer and everyone's response is posted but not 20 times; when I have brought the other over; it loses all of the other editor's formatting and to me is very confusing. I am still making headway on week six of the weekly discussions of My Early Life. I am going backwards in time to get them to post correctly. Just as an FYI. When I get done with six, I will let you know when I am starting week 5.

Thanks,

Bentley