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Suggestions & Questions > Half stars!

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message 1: by Danielle (new)

Danielle Franco-Malone (daniellefrancomalone) | 1 comments I can't believe that Goodreads does not use half stars! It seems like this would be such an easy feature to add and would make such a huge difference. The vast majority of my books end up being three or four stars and I would love to have the ability to differentiate between them a bit more. Does anyone know why this feature is not available?


message 2: by rivka, librarian moderator (new)

rivka | 11883 comments Mod
Because it's not as easy to add as you seem to think.

It may happen someday (I, for one, really hope so!), but the TPTB have made it clear that it's not a high priority.

Alas!

(Search the group and you'll find lots of previous threads on this topic.)


message 3: by Ralph (new)

Ralph (sunwriter) | 552 comments I hope they add half stars just so people stop requesting half stars.


message 4: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments I think that there should be a sticky topic on the discussion list of Feedback called 'half-stars' so that there wouldn't be a new one added every month or so.


message 5: by MissJessie (new)

MissJessie | 1712 comments Good idea Petra and it might actually motivate the PtB to work on it, difficult or not, to remove the irritation of a constant reminder.....


message 6: by rivka, librarian moderator (new)

rivka | 11883 comments Mod
Sticky topics don't keep people from posting new threads, and it's just as easy to ignore a new thread as it is to ignore new posts in an old thread.

In any case, Otis has recently stated that he considers this low-priority -- a stickied topic is unlikely to change that.


message 7: by MissJessie (new)

MissJessie | 1712 comments All too true...that's why I mentioned the irritant factor :)


message 8: by Shelli (new)

Shelli Wow..my group asked me and I thought I took the appropriate channel for this...apparently not because I didn't go and read thousands of posts to see that this has been mentioned SO many times before and it's not going to happen. When I decided to check on this yesterday, I saw Danielle's post and posted again. I guess I'll just delete my comments....I thought GR feedback was going to be a helpful place not a place where a posted comment IRRITATES everyone....sorry to bother you with my petty suggestion.


message 9: by Shelli (new)

Shelli Perhaps the questions and suggestions section needs to be updated!


message 10: by Hannah (new)

Hannah (HannahR) Shelli,
It was a reasonable suggestion to me, too. Don't know why all the catty comments.


message 11: by JK (last edited Oct 16, 2010 08:27AM) (new)

JK (eimajtl) | 111 comments Shelli wrote: "Wow..my group asked me and I thought I took the appropriate channel for this...apparently not because I didn't go and read thousands of posts to see that this has been mentioned SO many times befor..."

You don't have to read thousands of posts to see if something is mentioned.... just use the search feature in the group. It takes no time at all to search for a thread.


message 12: by Tatiana (new)

Tatiana (tatiana_g) | 71 comments Maybe then it would be a great idea to add a better search engine for discussion topics. The one we have right now searches all posts for keywords. I admit, when I have a suggestion, I have no patience to go through thousands of posts to see if there was in fact a discussion topic dedicated to my suggestion. I do check a couple of pages of more recent topics, but that's about it.


message 13: by MissJessie (new)

MissJessie | 1712 comments No need to feel guilty about raising the topic again; as Tatiana said, searching messages is not a practical idea as things stand.

And, if an idea is popular, even if GR PTB have said no, there's no sin in mentioning it. After all, GR is powered by the users and saying what would be nice is necessary feedback. Perhaps 1/2 stars will never happen (and I personally don't care at all) but it doesn't hurt to bring up items that are desired by us out here in the real world, as it were.

I don't think the remarks were catty, just honest either. Disagreeing isn't catty, it's just another point of view.


message 14: by Sashana (new)

Sashana | 124 comments Honestly, I think half stars should've been added a long time ago. Guess we'll have to wait and see though.


message 15: by Shelli (new)

Shelli Hannah wrote: "Shelli,
It was a reasonable suggestion to me, too. Don't know why all the catty comments."


Thanks...and actually I did search, which is how I found Danielle's comment to begin with. It's not a great way to do it as stated above.


message 16: by JK (new)

JK (eimajtl) | 111 comments Tatiana wrote: "Maybe then it would be a great idea to add a better search engine for discussion topics. The one we have right now searches all posts for keywords. I admit, when I have a suggestion, I have no pati..."

That's what keywords are for. If you do really basic keywords, yes, you'll get a lot of results, but if you actually think about what you are searching for and be specific, it's not hard.


On a side note, just searching "half stars" turns up about 400 results - hardly the thousands of posts the thread maker claimed she would have to go through. Adding a couple more words to that search would drastically cut down on the results too.


message 17: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments Shelli wrote: "Perhaps the questions and suggestions section needs to be updated!"

I think it might help if there was an updated list of things that Goodreads is working on that come up for discussion regularly. I know its available on the closed 'Infamous To Do List (April 2010) but that is six months since its last update, but could be extracted and a new closed thread established with just one post, a list: 'features we are working on' Then it would be extremely easy to check if the feature someone is interested in was on the list.

I don't know how 'thousands of messages' got in this, because if you search for half stars or half star ratings you get just 400 messages and just from scanning the first page of results, it is obvious that there are two threads worth clicking on - Half Stars and Half-star rating system in Goodreads,possible or not? That really doesn't take long to do at all.

I also think that the search engine is working really well. For a long time it wasn't good at all, but now its great. Having tags of main topics in each thread is a good idea but I don't think it would have improved on the results of searching for half stars anyway.

(Personally, I like the star system as it is now).


message 18: by Cheryl (new)

Cheryl (cherylllr) | 3291 comments I want two stars, aka thumb-up and thumb-down. And I'm only 1/2 kidding.

One of the things that comes up in the 1/2 star topics is that some people would actually prefer a 1-100 scale. And I know from filling out surveys online that it's now possible to just 'slide' a virtual 'bar' on a line to weight your response. No matter what scale we use, it can be a mess, and there will be people who aren't happy.

Put your details in your review - for example: "I liked this book's story and characters enough to give it 5 of 5 stars but it really wasn't well-written so objectively overall it's probably only worth 35/100 points."

With only two stars, the rating system would be much simpler and tidier. And we'd have none of this 'average rating of 3.57' silliness, either. Statistically, 3.57 is a 4, especially given the subjective limitations of how we rate books here.

I've begun a system at home to record and rate my short-story reading. For that I use three stars, meaning "awful, probably don't want to read anything else by this author" and "fine, good, whatever" and "amazing, read everything I can get by this author, recommend this story to all my friends." With this scale, almost all stories get rated 2 of 3.

I'm not actually asking for a switch to two stars, but I am contributing ideas that might help you who want 1/2 stars cope with your frustration as you see a different perspective. :)


message 19: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Vegan (LisaVegan) | 8582 comments Petra X wrote: "a new closed thread established with just one post, a list: 'features we are working on' Then it would be extremely easy to check if the feature someone is interested in was on the list."

I would love a starred thread such as this! With the priorities and progress included. That would be wonderful. I'm always curious about what's coming down the pike soon, what Goodreads really isn't that interested in implementing, etc.


message 20: by Cheryl (new)

Cheryl (cherylllr) | 3291 comments I sense they fear people saying "but you promised" if they list something as up-coming and then find out it's not feasible, for example. But even if they just noted items as 'working hard on this one' vs 'this is not going to happen so stop asking for it' vs 'maybe someday' that would be very helpful.


message 21: by mlady_rebecca (new)

mlady_rebecca | 2037 comments As for 1/2 stars, I don't think Otis is gung-ho on the idea. At least that was my impression. So he's never said no, but it's never gotten more than a low priority "maybe".

Personally, I think things are fine as they are, and wish they'd just list 1/2 stars as a solid "no".


message 22: by MissJessie (new)

MissJessie | 1712 comments Otis is opposed so far as I can tell.

As for fearing people would be disappointed if things aren't feasible, JUST SAY SO. Most people are reasonable and if there were occasional (as opposed to once or twice a year) updates of the progress of things, there would be a lot less repetitive questions on the subject(s).


And updating the APRIL to do list might just be an idea.

It is amazing what a little communication does to cut down on repetitive/duplicate questions or comments.


message 23: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments Even a bullet list of what features are in development even without progress bars would be useful for checking suggestions before posting to a new thread.


message 24: by Sashana (new)

Sashana | 124 comments I don’t think duplicate questions are a big deal, it shows how high demand certain features are. Obviously this is a very ‘hot’ topic and a lot of people are interested in half stars. Sadly, it doesn’t look like this feature will be added anytime soon.


message 25: by MissJessie (new)

MissJessie | 1712 comments There is a certain irritant value in constant repetition, it's true.

But it does get boring to read and even more boring for those who constantly have to repeat the same answers over and over again.

I like Petra's idea about a list of what's going on, to avoid constant repetition.


message 26: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments I think we interpret it the wrong way though. It feels like a kid going on all the time asking for the same thing in the hope that continual requests might get the decision changed, but it isn't like that at all. None of the people requesting half stars are aware of all the other threads on the same subject, so the reaction they get is a real (unpleasant) surprise to them.

If I can extend my idea. Not only a list but a note on suggestions that is a pop up the first time someone posts - please check the features-in-development list before starting a new topic.


message 27: by Nikki (new)

Nikki (shanaqui) | 1317 comments Once again, I find myself pondering how "I half think it was amazing" (4.5 stars) isn't covered by "I really liked it" (4 stars). I have 999 books listed on my shelves, so trust me, I know that it's hard to sort a diverse range of books into just five rating categories... But trust me, once you get to 999, it'd not be much easier sorting them into ten rating categories.

I'm still anti-half stars. I prefer the constant stream of people asking the same old question to the idea of the implementation of a "feature" that might even drive me away from GR! Heh.


message 28: by mlady_rebecca (new)

mlady_rebecca | 2037 comments Petra X wrote: "It feels like a kid going on all the time asking for the same thing in the hope that continual requests might get the decision changed"

That's exactly how it feels. And if you continue with that metaphor, sometimes asking one time too many takes away any possibility of ever getting what you want. It becomes a "no" just on principal.


message 29: by Alias Reader (last edited Oct 17, 2010 07:27AM) (new)

Alias Reader (AliasReader) | 182 comments I like that this topic keeps coming up. Maybe then GR will realize it shouldn't be at the bottom of their To Do List as it is something their customers are constantly asking for.


message 30: by Nikki (new)

Nikki (shanaqui) | 1317 comments Alias Reader wrote: "I like that this topic keeps coming up. Maybe then GR will realize it shouldn't be at the bottom of their To Do List as it is something their customers are constantly asking for."

Or, you know, something various people don't care about or don't want at all, like me.


message 31: by MissJessie (new)

MissJessie | 1712 comments I don't care at all either, but it seems to be so important to so many people that I support the idea just for the "general good".

So many people want it--and GR generally has a high level of providing what is wanted -- that it doesn't offend me personally to see it brought up again and again.......


message 32: by Sheila (new)

Sheila  | 574 comments I'm just curious....given that the current 5 star rating system already has classifications for each rating (that pop up when you arrow over the star):

1 star: didn't like it
2 stars: it was okay
3 stars: liked it
4 stars: really liked it
5 stars: it was amazing

What comments would you give to the 1/2 star ratings?

As a note, I would think that all the current ratings would have to stay the same, since I'm sure there would be an uproar if they changed, as many people (including me) would not want to have to go back and re-star all our books if the current ratings changed.

So what are some ideas for comments for all the 1/2 star ratings, that would fit between the current classifications?

(this could be fun!) :o)


message 33: by Lisa (last edited Oct 17, 2010 09:40AM) (new)

Lisa Vegan (LisaVegan) | 8582 comments We wouldn't need any comments for the half stars; it would be obvious they were in-between the others. Which makes perfect sense to me. ;-) (And after I promised myself I was going to start staying out of the half star discussion forevermore.)

ETA: for me, for instance, 4-1/2 stars would be I loved it.


message 34: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments Lisa wrote: "And after I promised myself I was going to start staying out of the half star discussion forevermore"

Me too. But....I often find myself thinking a book is, say, a 4-1/2 star book. Five stars because it was brilliant but spoiled, just a bit by.... So I write it in the review. My 2000+ books are all accurately rated, I like the simple 5 star system, I do not want suddenly to find that some books are now inaccurately slightly too high or slightly too low because of a whole new rating scheme.

Half-star ratings wouldn't affect the overall rating of a book anyway, it would just be, to some, a more precise rating of how they felt about the book, and that could be reflected in writing a review, even one that says just '4-1/2 stars - I loved it'.


message 35: by willaful (new)

willaful | 805 comments Petra X wrote: "It feels like a kid going on all the time asking for the same thing in the hope that continual requests might get the decision changed, but it isn't like that at all. "

To expand on this, it isn't like that because each person is one more voice voting "I want this."


message 36: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments I don't understand why you quoted me since I said it felt like that and then that it isn't like that at all.


message 37: by willaful (new)

willaful | 805 comments Yes, and I was expanding on what you said, not disagreeing with you.


message 38: by Deborah (new)

Deborah | 1329 comments I want half stars even more now that we have the stats page. I'm about to wrap to the third line for three stars for this year and did for last year.


message 39: by Nikki (new)

Nikki (shanaqui) | 1317 comments Deborah wrote: "I want half stars even more now that we have the stats page. I'm about to wrap to the third line for three stars for this year and did for last year."

I don't understand the connection, there, I have to say...


message 40: by rivka, librarian moderator (new)

rivka | 11883 comments Mod
She wants to be able to split them between 3 and 3.5, I imagine.


message 41: by Nikki (new)

Nikki (shanaqui) | 1317 comments I see. I just... if I did that, I'd still have multiple lines under each star value, I think. Heh.


message 42: by Deborah (new)

Deborah | 1329 comments People keep saying,"Just put the half stars in your review." That doesn't fix the stats page.


message 43: by Ralph (new)

Ralph (sunwriter) | 552 comments BunWat wrote: "Deborah wrote: "People keep saying,"Just put the half stars in your review." That doesn't fix the stats page."

I don't think the stats page is broken. If you have too many 3 star ratings to fit..."


I'm pretty sure she means it doesn't help her see how many books she rated 3.5 stars, not that the page is actually broken.


message 44: by rivka, librarian moderator (new)

rivka | 11883 comments Mod
That's how I read it as well.


message 45: by Nikki (last edited Oct 18, 2010 10:54AM) (new)

Nikki (shanaqui) | 1317 comments I was actually tempted to respond with exactly the same first line as BunWat, in terms of the saying, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".


message 46: by Deborah (new)

Deborah | 1329 comments I never said anything was broken. Putting half stars in the review doesn't show on the stats page. The stats page highlights how inaccurate my rating are without half stars. If I had half stars, I wouldn't have so many three star books, some should be 2.5 and some should be 3.5.


message 47: by Nikki (new)

Nikki (shanaqui) | 1317 comments Not convinced that adding more rating categories actually makes ratings more accurate, given the total subjectivity of the whole system. But I've said this before.


message 48: by rivka, librarian moderator (new)

rivka | 11883 comments Mod
I doubt it's the wrapping so much as the fact that it indicates exceeding a certain number.

BunWat wrote: "Oh by the way, I forgot how to access the stats page. (Evidence of how often I use it, heh heh). How do I get to it again?"

On your "my books" page, under the list of shelves, there's a link that says "stats". (There are a few other ways to get there too.)


message 49: by Deborah (last edited Oct 18, 2010 12:12PM) (new)

Deborah | 1329 comments Nikki wrote: "Not convinced that adding more rating categories actually makes ratings more accurate, given the total subjectivity of the whole system. But I've said this before."

That only makes sense if you're talking about average ratings and I'm not. I only care about my own ratings and to be accurate, I need more categories.


message 50: by Petar X (new)

Petar X (PetraX) | 5613 comments I think that if the rating system is going to be changed then there ought to be a general debate about change to what. Because if its going to be changed I would like bombs, gold stars and a slide bar for rating 1-100, I don't want to have to rerate my books on a 9 point scale, if we are going for total interpretation of feelings by ratings, then that would be much more precise.

As Nikki says, it won't make the ratings of books any more accurate, but it might lead to Greater Personal Satisfaction.


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