Hi everybody,

Thought I'd move Certain Girls discussion over here, since many of you were concerned about spoilers in the welcome thread.

Discuss freely!

SPOILER ALERT!! DO NOT LOOK DOWN!! ESPECIALLY NOT IF YOU HAVEN'T READ THE BOOK!! I'M A BIG SPOILER!

Peter's death still stings - and I'm trying to understand. I guess that's what Patrice means by "giving you grief about the conclusion."

I don't think I'm necessarily one who requires a happy ending. My "lawyer-english major-mom" brain appreciates a story that speaks to me, no matter the ending. And don't get me wrong, the book spoke to me. I winced repeatedly as I recognized myself in Joy's interaction with her mother. I suppose my problem is how unsatisfied I felt at the end - not something I'm used to at the conclusions of your books.

This is not "grief," I am merely looking for any insights as to why he had to die. (Insert Waaa here).

Thanks.

Not a question, but a comment. Having lived through my brother's spouse unexpectedly dying at the young age of 31 and seeing him raise their son on his own, I sobbed until 4 AM after reading Certain Girls. I did not want Peter to die, but I can accept it. You did a wonderful job with this story!!

i too had trouble with the ending and peter's death. it felt sudden but left a great opening for a third book. was this part of your master plan while writing certain girls?

also, what authors do you enjoy reading? can you recommend a new book or author, now that i've read your collection?

I have to echo the general consensus here that Peter's death came with an incredible sting. Hasn't poor Cannie been through enough? Is there no other way Joy would have grown out of her tweenishness? Teens and tweens all over the country grow out of their I-Hate-My-Parents stage without having to face incredible tragedy to do so.

Here’s the thing: I knew how CERTAIN GIRLS was going to end before I started it. I knew that Peter was going to die before I sat down and wrote Word One. (And it’s strange for reviewers to say that they didn’t see it coming, because when you look at the very first conversation this character has, it’s all about death).

So: I knew that Peter was going to die, and it didn’t make me happy (and I knew that readers would howl, and believe me, that prospect did not delight me, either). Here’s the thing: I believe, at some deep-down level, that writers are, at least to a certain extent, as the editor Maxwell Perkins once said of Thomas Wolfe, divine wind-chimes. I also believe, to quote Stephen King, that 85 percent of what goes on in a writer’s head is none of his (or her) business. We’re not necessarily the ones telling the story, it’s more like the stories bubble up from somewhere, and we just get to put them down on paper…and then edit, and rewrite, and revise, and cut, and rewrite and edit some more.

I also think the ending was kind of hard but fitting. I think that Cannie’s story is always going to be about surviving the worst thing you can imagine, and going forward and finding happiness in spite of it. It’s the bitter with the sweet thing, the joy in the midst of sorrow.

That being said, I will tell you that this is the first book when I’ve ever gotten a phone call from my Mom that basically consisted of her yelling “How COULD you??!?!” in various tones and at different volumes. That was interesting.

I didn't have a three-book master plan while writing, but I do think the door is definitely open. Cannie: the hot flash years!

As for what I'm reading, I read a bunch of books at a time. Currently on my nightstand: Julie Buxbaum's THE OPPOSITE OF LOVE, the re-release of Ann Hood's SOMEWHERE OFF THE COAST OF MAINE (her latest book, THE KNITTING CIRCLE, just about broke my heart), Sarah Hall's DAUGHTERS OF THE NORTH, Marc Acito's ATTACK OF THE THEATER PEOPLE (I loved it so much I blurbed it, but my blurb got in too late, but trust me, it's hilarious), Suzanne Finnamore's SPLIT, Stephen King's ROSE MADDER (I'm re-reading it) Max Apple's THE JEW OF HOME DEPOT, THE SOLOIST by Steve Lopez, and SO THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE FOR, which is a breastfeeding guide, so it's more of a niche audience thing. I'm looking forward to new books by Jen Lancaster and Emily Giffin. And I read Tori Spelling's autobiography on the plane trip back from L.A. last week, and I liked it. So there.

My absolute favorite author of all time is Susan Isaacs, whose work I cannot recommend highly enough...and if you're looking for Cannie's literary ancestress, check out Gail Parent's SHEILA LEVINE IS DEAD AND LIVING IN NEW YORK.

well, I missed the clues about Peter dying--and sobbed through the last three chapters of the book! My 11 yr old son found this vastly amusing. ;-)
For some reason, Peter's death really hit me hard. They were such a good couple, they "worked" on so many levels. I loved that he was a diet (excuse me, bariatric) doctor who didn't care that she's wasn't thin. I am recently divorced and it is sometimes hard for me to see couples who are happy--but this time, it was just the opposite--I was as heartbroken as if I had lost Peter myself! A sign of good writing, I'd say!

Karen

Yikes! I certainly missed the signs too, which I almost preferred, because then I was right there with Cannie--
I, too, cried through the end. When I least expected it,I was fortunate enough to have found my true partner in life, friendship, parenthood...a relationship I honestly could never have believed could actually, really-truly exist. The thought of his death, soon, before we get to go through all of the amazingly wonderful mundane, essential parts of life (next season of "I know my kid's a star", our grandbabies, finding the next perfect under $10 wine, unclogging the next toilet) is wrenching. Unbearable. Jennifer, your understanding of marriage must be a testimony to your own experience with it. LOVED IT!!!

Carolyn

For some reason I thought something was going to happen to Joy, so I too was shocked when Peter died (I cried as well). It is, however, refreshing to still get a surprise at the end of a novel- Thank you Jennifer for that! Most of the books I have read lately have been fairly predictable.

Jennifer, how long did it take you to write Certain Girls? What made you wait until now to do a sequel to Good in Bed?

Thank you!!
Alicia

Thank you! This was exactly was I was looking for. I loved that I didn't see Peter's death coming, probably because I didn't want to! I fell in love with him long before Cannie did in Good in Bed (he reminds me a lot of my husband).

For some reason I'm glad to hear that you began the book knowing the full outcome and that there wasn't a point in the writing process where you thought 'Peter must die!' While we feel Cannie's loss, the ending managed to be so rich and fulfilling with Joy taking big steps toward adulthood. The cyclical aspect of the book was done with a light and satisfying touch.

I hope we hear more from Cannie, hot flashes or not!

Jen Lancaster will be at the Borders on Broad St. on Friday night! :)

YEAH! for author chats!! I was really confused by the husbands death in certain girls. It bugged me. I guess i do like happy endings, and it was actually a happy ending.. but well it just confused me.. like it was out of place? Hopefully this is the place for questions....so my question: had you planned for him to pass since the beginning or did it work out as you were writing it?

Jessica - see message #6 above ( :

It sounds like Jennifer went into the book with a clear idea regarding the ending.

It was hard to see Cannie suffer, and yet it was so perfect that Peter had wanted another child, he had been the instigating force in searching for a surrogate mother, and at the end of the book, the arrival of their baby helps her pull herself through the grief of his death.

Hi Jennifer,

I was also devastated by Peter's death. I didn't see it coming at all. As a writer, I understand that we don't necessarily have a choice over where our books take us, but wow! I felt such sadness that Cannie always has to struggle. I was depressed for the rest of the day! Peter felt so real to me.

That said, I still enjoyed the book and was so thrilled that you wrote another novel, especially a sequel to Cannie's story.

It's a huge compliment to your work that your readers are so moved/outraged by Peter's demise.

Cheers,
Holli

well maybe not "cannie: the hot flash years" for the third book, but perhaps a book about joy's college years.

thanks for responding! :)

I must say I really enjoyed this book! Minor rant - at first I wasn't thrilled with the swtiching of narrators every other chapter but the style eventually grew on me.

Good book!!!

it was confusing for me too:)

I missed the clues about Peter as well but I must say that I really enjoyed reading this book.

I recommended "Good in Bed" to so many of my friends years ago and now I'm just waiting for their reactions to "Certain Girls".

Hi Jennifer,
I literally just finished Certain Girls 10 minutes ago and the tears are still rolling down my face. I don't want to sound so dramatic, but I'm devastated over here. The fat girl had to lose the man who loved her so unconditionally? What's with that? I'm sure this will speak tons about my own damaged psyche (and, why, yes, I am a fatty), but this just sucks! Your books are more than "Chick Lit"; they've always had depth. But one expects a happy ending, and you didn't give it to us. I'm now staring at my lovely, wonderful husband like a ticking time bomb! God, I know I'm sounding harsh, and you probably won't believe me, but you are one of my favorite authors. I guess, at the moment, I feel betrayed. More importanly, you betrayed Cannie. My heart is breaking for her. Please, please write another book where she finds romantic happiness again. (If I sound like a total loon, please excuse me...I get really emotionally invested in my literature.)

I was completely shocked by Peter's death. Apparently I did need scooby-doo and the gang to see that one early. Like many others I cried through the last few chapters. My poor clueless husband awoke to me bawling and clinging. I'm sure he is still a bit confused by my explanation. I love how "involved" in the character's lives I get. I feel a fantastic author is one you laugh and cry with and close the book imagining the character's tomorrows. Thank you Jennifer!

Jennifer-

Until I came here this morning and read your comments I was pretty upset and disappointed with the ending of this book. I finished it last night in tears, like so many others!

But upthread when you described Cannie as someone who has to deal with the worst possible things life throws at you- and still try and find a path toward happiness, it all made sense. Cannie has always been about forging ahead and dealing with the pain. She is a very real character and I look forward to your next story. No pressure! ;-)

I read the book the first week it came out and I can only now write comments about the emotion I felt.

I will start by saying that I truly LOVED 'Certain Girls'. I didn't think that I would like the tone being told by 2 points of view but it was very interesting.

Unlike most of you, I did see Peter's death coming; it didn't make it any easier to accept. I guess I was too close to the story line. I relate very closely with Joy. My father died just months before I turned 13. Maybe that is why I saw it coming.

Even though Peter died I liked the way the story of Cannie played out. She still gives me strength and reminds me that no matter what life throws at you there is ALWYS a way to handle it with grace.

I can't wait for more books by Jennifer. I am addicted to all of her novels. I want a sequel to 'Good Night Nobody" but I am afraid about who Kate will end up with...Ben or Evan. I don't know if I am ready for that or not.

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE THIS BOOK! It is my most favorite of your books! I love Cannie. I want her to be my friend. I love the back and forth relationship with her daughter. I love how her daughter grows up throughout the book. It's such a great read. I was so sad when Peter died, but then it seemed so fitting to me. Cannie and Joy are a team. They are there for each other. So having Peter gone seemed fitting, in some eerie way.