I've been meaning to get to Carey's books for awhile. I love his graphic novels and I'm happy to hear that thay are dark reads as well. :) And I'm sure other readers appreciate the warnings you included.

I also love the list you included. I've only read Sunshine (which, sorry to say, I did not enjoy) but the others sound extremely promising. I love dark urban fanstay and am always looking for recs in the genre.

Thanks for the referral to this thread, Kathryn, there area some interesting titles here! I did add a couple of books to the group bookshelves. I think the Felix Castor series by Mike Carey fits the bill for "dark" It does have an urban fantasy/mystery framework like so many of the series mentioned; however, I found it darker and more gritty. There are elements of human trafficking, demon worship, possession, a child in mortal danger, and ruthless murders here. I don't mention this to glorify those topics, but as an advisory if those subjects are offensive to some members. I did not think the treatment was gratuitous or excessive.

Other books I think the group would enjoy include Caitlin Kiernan's Threshold and its sequel Low Red Moon - very atmospheric and creepy. Also Four and Twenty Blackbirds, Wings to the Kingdom, and Not Flesh nor Feathers by Cherie Priest. John Connolly's Nocturnes was quite good (short stories) and Robin McKinley's Sunshine was awesome!

I hope you like it, Kathryn. :)

Danielle, I love your recommendations and Nightlife has been on my shelves for awhile so I think I'll try to get my hands on it sooner. I am really looking forward to reading it! :)

Might not be your cup of tea, Heather. No worries there.

I'm currently reading Nightlife and while I love Cal and Niko (mainly their snarky comments) I don't care for this book. I'm not sure why...

Kathryn have you read the Cal Leandros books? I consider this dark fantasy. Cal is short for Caliban because his father is an auphe, a dark elf. And the relatives want to get Cal back. The first book is Nightlife and I loved it.

I think of urban fantasy as an offshoot of fantasy but often occult detective stories, where the crime being solved is a supernatural one. I'm kind of weird compared to some urban fantasy fans. I don't expect the protagonist to be a kickbutt woman. I like urban fantasy with men as the protagonists just as much. And I don't like too much romance in the UF story. I think it gets in the way of the narrative. I want to see supernatural elements, particularly the hero/heroine at risk, lots of action or intriguing storyline. I don't mind if there is a love interest. I just don't want it to be too focused on the romance/sex aspects.

Shanon wrote: "I'm currently reading Thorn Queen which is the 2nd book in the Dark Swan series. It's turning out to be much darker than I was anticipating (which is a good thing). I don't remembe..."

Thanks Shanon, you know those are my favorite kinds of books! I am defintiely interested in reading the series you mentioned and maybe checking out the Succubus series as well.

I'm currently reading Thorn Queen which is the 2nd book in the Dark Swan series. It's turning out to be much darker than I was anticipating (which is a good thing). I don't remember the first book tackling dark themes ... well maybe but... || crinkles eyebrows|| How to describe something without giving away potential spoilers is quite tricky at times.

OK enough rambling! It's a good book set in a unique world and I'd recommend it if you're looking for an Urban Fantasy with a little grit.

I'm hoping to soon tackle the Tithe series as well. I've heard many people comment on how dark it is, considering it's young adult. Jillian, good to hear you agree!

Wow. Lots of great recommendations in this thread! What about the Holly Black Tithe series? It is YA, but very good. Definitely has a darker slant to it...

Great, I was hoping for that. I still need to find it :)

I just finished Already Dead and it's dark for Urban Fantasy.

I doubt my library has it so I'll be ordering it as a loan whenever my other orders show up and I can read and return one. :)

Hmmm. I have that series around here somewhere. May need to pull it out and read it.

A wonderful friend of mine on this site just recommended Blood and Iron and I am super excited to get my hands on it. It sounds exactly like what I've been looking for. So, new_user, if you happen to be looking over my shoulder again, thanks, and I hope you don't mind that I 'm sharing this with the group :)

"Hey, Kathryn, I was looking over your shoulder (LOL) and saw you were looking for darker urban fantasy, so I thought you might like this one. This is UF centered around the fae, the dark, chilling kind based on the original mythology (especially the kelpies), even though it's definitely modern and "modernized." The prose is also elegant, evocative and sensual (though this is not a romance and there are no couples or anything like that). I would probably compare her to Jacqueline Carey. If you're interested in a book where the odds are definitely against the heroine and she doesn't always triumph (no HEA yet!) -and, in fact, toes the line between hero and villain sometimes- I think you'll be interested in this one. It was too dark for me, but maybe you'll enjoy it more."

Lilith Saintcrow's books are definitely dark urban fantasy. My favorite series of hers (and probably the darkest) is the Jill Kismet series. The most recent one, Redemption Alley, is the darkest of her books, in my opinion.

COMPLETE sense. I like a little fantasy in my books to make them more enjoyable but that doesn't mean I don't like a serious story, plot, problem that can relate to all not just the supernatural.

I'm afraid you're right Shanon. There is alot of fluff out there, which is still fun, but I wish more stories were fun and serious, if that makes any sense.

I really wish more authors would tackle some harder subjects in this genre. For me, Dark Fiction (in any genre) generates introspection of myself or my ideas on society.

I know that the later Mercy Thompson books have her dealing with the after effects of an attack that make me think how I would handle the same situation. But all too often Urban Fantasy is just fluff really.

Thanks Shanon! I tried The Witching Hour years ago but didn't enjoy it too much, even though it was very dark. I'm planning to read My Soul to Lose soon, as I really enjoyed the prequel, which I strongly recommend be read first. I'll have to peak at Saintcrow's series again. Thanks!

Kathryn wrote: "I think Shanon meant Kim Harrison's Hollows series. :)"

Yup Yup! Sorry - I'm reading Caine right now. Sorry for the confusion!


As to Dark Urban Fantasy - that gets tricky. I can't think of any really DARK books but maybe "DIM" if that's an option :)

I would consider My Soul to Lose to be kind-of dark because the heroine was committed to a mental health ward for seeing death. From what I can tell the next book in the series isn't in the mental health ward so may not have some of the darker elements with side characters and their battle with themselves & their illnesses / perceived illnesses.

I know with Magic to the Bone I was left sad for the character and her situation. I don't want to go any further than that because I'd be entering spoiler territory to do so.

The Witching Hour was VERY dark, come to think of it. It was just SO long and drawn out I haven't picked up the other Mayfair Witches books yet.

I've heard some people say Lilith Saintcrow's Dante Valentine series is dark but I never was able to get into the series so I'm not the proper judge.

I'd love some suggestions too!

So, does anyone have any recommendations for DARK urban fantasy? I want to stear the conversation towards dark fiction and not just any urban fantasy, even though I love some of those series too.

Dead Witch Walking is the first book in Caine's Harrison's Hollows series. The series is also referred to as Rachel Morgan (the name of the main character) sometimes.

I HIGHLY recommend it! Very good series - though I'm not sure I would consider it dark. It's a strong Urban Fantasy with little bits of romance peppered throughout. Wonderful characters and stories.

EDIT: Fixed author's name - oops!

When you all say Hollows series, which books are you referring to? I really want to try a series of her's. I believe the first book is Dead Witch Walking. Have either of you read it?

Oh, I just remembered another great Urban Fantasy that I somehow forgot to mention...

The Succubus series by Richelle Mead. Don't be detered by the title, they are very well written, and not nearly as smutty as the covers and title suggest.

Ah, yes, I do not enjoy overly whiny :)

Allie Beckstrom only has 2 books out right now so it's a little hard to say it's a favorite. BUT the 3rd book is coming out in November and I'll be reading it as soon as it does. While reading it I was reminded of Rachel from Kim Harrison's Hollows series because they're both down and out in a BIG way but stay strong (and not overly whiny!).

Yes, Caine's Weather Warden series is one of my all time favorites. Probably Caine's, Sookie Stackhouse, and the Watch series at the top, followed by Harrison's and Brigg's but I'm probably forgetting something. I think I have Allie Beckstrom marked to read but I think I'll move it up.

Ah thanks for the plug Kathryn! There's been some "drama" with City of Bones so I'm curious to see how the discussions will pan out in a few weeks :)

I think Urban Fantasy is my favorite genre overall. My favorite books within the genre are usually pretty dark. My favorite series (in random order) are Rachel Caine's Weather Warden, Kim Harrison's Hollows and I think Devon Monk's Allie Beckstrom is edging into my top three at the moment.

I'm always on the hunt for something within Urban Fantasy that tackles darker aspects of life with a little fantasy thrown in to keep me enteratained.

I'm about to begin reading the Sookie books by Harris.

Ink Exchange was my favorite as well, I'm looking forward to the next installment.

I would certainly say that Kelley Armstrong falls under Dark Fiction and I suppose Mortal Instruments would too. While Mortal Instruments is YA, it does tackle several internal issues that the characters face as well as an ultimate battle of good vs. evil. I'm not sure what I would compare it to though.

Thanks for the rec, I'll check it out.

I've enjoyed Marr's series and Ink Exchange was probably my favorite so far.

Heather, the other books you mention, you do consider those to be dark fiction? I haven't read either Mortal Instruments or Armstrong's series and though I've looked the books over, I'm not planning on reading them soon. (By the way, you should check out Shanon and *Stephanie*'s Witches, Weres, & Vamps group. Both series are being read by the group).

Michelle and I are currently reading through Charlaine Harris' Harper Connelly series, which I guess is mostly mystery with dashes of paranormal.

Oh, if anyone needs a book that tackles a dark suject for the reading challenge, I recommend Ink Exchange by Marr. The heroine is a recent rape victim and it also tackles addiction.

I love love love a YA series called The Mortal Instruments series. It's Urban Fantasy and, if you couldn't tell by my writing love 3 times, I thought it was fantastic. First book is titled City of Bones, followed by City of Ashes, and City of Glass is the conclusion of the series.

I also adore just about anything written by Kelley Armstrong, though I'm not sure you can call it Urban Fantasy.

Melissa Marr is urban fantasy and she is yet another wonderful writer. Her books Wicked Lovely, Ink Exchange and Fragile Eternity are very inventive and beautifully written.

Another series that I notice most people tend to categorize as fantasy is Sergei Lukyanenko's Watch books. I have only read the first 2, which I loved, and I plan on reading the last 2 soon but I feel that the series is strong urban fantasy, maybe the best example of why I love the genre.

Now I know that most people consider urban fantasy to be a smaller sister genre of paranormal romance, but I've wanted to generate some discussion about darker urban fantasies since this group started, particularly since I consider the genre to be my favorite, or at least most addictive genre. I love urban fantasy but what pushes a series into the excellent region for me is an author's ability to tackle darker topics. My favorite series meld romance, to varrying degrees, with difficult sujects. Patricia Brigg's Mercy Thompson series comes to mind (don't worry, no spoilers allowed in this thread!). I like Kim Harrison's series for similiar reasons.

Basically, I just wanted to start the ball rolling for recommendations of dark urban fantasy. I realize that everyone has differing opinions on what constitutes "dark" but feel free to mention anything that fits your definition.