Trevor's Reviews > Cognitive Development: Its Cultural and Social Foundations
Cognitive Development: Its Cultural and Social Foundations
by Alexander R. Luria
by Alexander R. Luria
Trevor's review
bookshelves: education, history, philosophy, psychology, science, social-theory
Apr 30, 11
bookshelves: education, history, philosophy, psychology, science, social-theory
Read from April 29 to 30, 2011
I struggled to get hold of this book, it having been borrowed from the Uni library and not available from any of my other libraries. So, I’ve spent the last couple of days reading it at the State Library. The reason why this became something urgent for me to read is that I’ve been reading lots of Bourdieu and his criticism of Bernstein. Bernstein sees access to literacy as being something that also gives access to cognitive skills and abilities that are simply not available without it. Bourdieu makes somewhat similar conclusions, but sees some of the advantages of literacy as being subjective – that they give access to things that are considered better by ‘taste’, but less ‘objectively’ advantages. Any advantage, according to what I can work out from Bourdieu, is mostly due to what he calls habitas – to the lifestyle of the person and their need for social distinction which is made more ‘distinct’ if it is hard to achieve. So, the only ‘objective’ advantages of the literacy and cognitive abilities is the difficulty they have in being achieved – a bit like the reason why gold is worth more than bread.
But somewhere at the back of my mind I’ve been thinking about Luria. I learnt of this book from reading a book on research (which I’ll get to reviewing at some stage) and he has been troubling me (although only at the back of my mind, really). The book on research mentions this book as an exemplary example of social research. It would be hard to overstate this. This really is a fantastic book. The fact it was a bit hard to get my hands on probably made it all the more interesting in a way – but it has given me lots to think about.
I’ve written about Vygotsky before (Lev Vygotsky: Revolutionary Scientist) and Luria was involved in Vygotsky’s school. Vygotsky is very trendy (particularly at Melbourne Uni) although, admittedly, much more last year than he has proven to be this year. Mostly people were interested in his Zones of Proximal Development. But he also had ideas about the social nature of cognitive development – and it is these that I’ve been thinking about lately and that have made reading this book important.
To have a theory of cognitive development you need a kind of ladder in your head. You need to know that Kind A cognitive behaviour is of a lower type than Kind B. You need some idea of what you can do, given someone at Kind A level, to move your student towards the Kind B level.
This fits with the Bernstein and Bourdieu concern I have because if you can say that one kind of cognitive behaviour is, in fact, at a lower level to another kind of cognitive behaviour then teaching makes sense – that is, learning makes more sense than just being about show and ostentation.
In the 1930s in the Soviet Union there were all of those republics down near Turkey that end in –stan. One of them was Uzbekistan and Luria headed off there to do some research on the locals. Here were a group of people who were mostly illiterate and essentially feudal peasants. They were being placed in a kind of time machine and raced forward a couple of centuries.
Marxism holds that we are products of our social environment. Not just a little bit, but entirely products of that environment. Luria and Vygotsky took Marx at his word. They said that it should be possible to see real and predictable differences in how people think given the fact they are from socially more backward (less developed) cultures. That is, as Luria puts it, “some mental processes cannot develop apart from the appropriate forms of social life.”
He goes on to say what a rare opportunity has been offered him to do this research, “Psychology has made few attempts to deal with this problem, partly because of the infrequency of occasions when an investigator can observe how the restructuring of social systems has brought about rapidly changing forms of consciousness…”
The point being that, “We hypothesised that people with a primarily graphic-functional reflection of reality would show a different system of mental process from people with a predominantly abstract, verbal, and logical approach to reality.” (By graphic-functional, he just means that these people are fixated with concrete thinking, that they think ‘practically’, but rarely ‘theoretically’)
So, off he goes with other researchers and a series of brilliantly clever tests.
One of the debates that comes up from time to time is whether or not people see colours differently based on the language community they come from – this is particularly interesting if people come from language groups with different names for colours. For example, we have light and dark blue (but both are ‘blue’), whereas languages like Russian and French have quite different words for these two colours – and so they are seen as two colours in those language communities, rather than our one colour and two shades. However, few people in any language community is likely to have more than say 20 words they are likely to use to define colours. After you get through red, blue, green, yellow and so on you are probably going to start struggling. I’m taking it as read that people who can tell the difference between puce, burgundy and scarlet are basically oddities (if not actually wankers).
Luria’s test was to show people a series of coloured pieces of cloth and to ask them to group them according to the colours. Some people found this task quite easy (those schooled in the standard names we have for colours) who could arrange the colours according to those names and intensity – dark red, red, pink, white and so on. Others – a group of illiterate women in particular – simply said it couldn’t be done. And why? Well, they grouped the colours not on any abstract scheme of colour names, but rather according to what the colours reminded them of in the real world. I need to quote this:
“The group of ichkari women, however, presented us with an entirely different system. As a rule, the instruction to divide the colours into groups created complete confusion and called forth responses such as, ‘It can’t be done,’ ‘None of them are the same, you can’t put them together,’ ‘They’re not at all alike,’ or ‘This is like calf’s-dung, and this is like a peach.’ The women usually began by putting different skeins together, then attempted to explain their colour groups but shook their heads in perplexity and failed to complete the task.”
It is really important to see what is happening here. The women are not saying, ‘oh yes, nice pink, that will go with the hot pink over there and that will work well with the red’. They are saying, ‘this one looks like a peach and that one looks like cow dung – well, they don’t go together, clearly – hmm, none that look like cream, what to do?’ They don’t have an abstract scheme for colours, they have a highly practical understanding of colours as they appear in their daily world.
This is a hurdle that comes to haunt these people time and time again. Often the women grouped the colours by their intensity – so the dark reds, blues and greens were all together, but the light colours of these same colours were in different piles. But invariably these schemas would fall apart for one reason or another.
The researchers tried much the same with geometrical shapes and asked the peasants to group those. There were triangles and squares, but some constructed of lines and some of dashes and some of dots. These would invariably be grouped according their resemblance to concrete objects – a square might look like a watch (particularly one constructed by a series of dots – as these would represent the hours on the face) and a square made of solid lines may be a glass. These would then never be put into the same category. Even when the researcher gave hints and more.
Perhaps the most fascinating of all, though, was the work with optical illusions. When we look at an optical illusion – like those ones where the same size circle is placed in the middle of either a series of small or big other circles – we imagine that every human being would look at these in exactly the same way and be ‘fooled’ in the same way. These experiments showed that this was not the case: “It turned out that optical illusions are not universal. … The number of cases (where people saw the illusion) dropped proportionately in groups whose educational qualifications were lower. Thus the data clearly show that optical illusions are linked to complex psychological processes that vary in accordance with socio-historical development.”
The researchers then did interesting things with seeing how well people would be able to categorise objects. This really was mind-blowing. Essentially, they were playing that Sesame Street game where they sing, ‘One of these things is not like the other ones’. The objects presented were an ax, a saw, a hammer and a log. (I presume no one needs to be told the log is the odd one out), people invariably said they all belonged together and none could be taken away (the logic being that a tool is no use without something to work it on, so the log was needed too) The researchers then spoke about a mystery person who had done the test before and was crazy enough to have suggested the log might be the odd one out. I will quote some of the reported conversations this provoked from the illiterate peasants:
“But one fellow picked three things – the hammer, saw and hatchet – and said they were alike.
‘A saw, a hammer and a hatchet all have to work together. But the log has to be there too!”
Why do you think he picked those three things and not the log?
‘Probably he’s got a lot of firewood, but if we’ll be left without firewood, we won’t be able to do anything.’
True, but a hammer, a saw and a hatchet are all tools.
‘Yes, but even if we have tools, we still need wood – otherwise, we can’t build anything.’”
I find that a particularly fascinating exchange. What is most fascinating about it is the fact that the peasant is incapable of thinking outside of the practical situation created. What is also amazing is that their language ever developed a word like ‘tools’ if people were unable to distinguish that level of abstraction. Vygotsky’s point is that the language may have this word because those further up the pecking order would have been able to deal more in abstractions, but to the peasants words would actually have much more concrete meanings – they would not really be the basis of abstract categories as they are for us, but have meaning that were much more fluid and much more tied to the practical situations the peasants found themselves in. In some cases ‘food’ is also seen as a tool as a man can’t work without a full stomach.
Of the illiterate peasants some 80% of them were never able to do any of the tests in a way that showed they ‘got’ the abstract category idea, they always grouped according to the practical principle of a task or a use – if a concrete story could be made to group the elements then all of the elements of the story became part of the category. Of those who had had even a little schooling, but were barely literate 70% were able to form the correct categorical principle – of those more literate 100% were able to.
One of the things that is said about this, which I’ve found remarkably interesting, is that, “it is far more difficult to establish a resemblance between objects” than difference between objects. This is actually obvious when you think about it, but a remarkable observation all the same. Asking someone to tell you why two things are different is a ‘concrete task’. All of the differences are apparent and there in front of you. However, asking someone to tell you why two different things are similar is infinitely harder. You need to be able to have abstract categories in which to link the objects to so as to point out their similarities.
People also found it impossible to explain things – when asked to imagine they had to tell someone what a car or the sun were to someone who had never seen either of them before they said that they would not be able to do such a thing – that personal experience was the only means open to people to understand anything.
Which brings me up to the point where I should stop – despite only having explained half of the book. The only other thing I will mention is syllogisms. This, again, needs to be quoted, as it is a deep and important philosophical point – so I’ll end just after this extended quote:
“Conceptual thinking involves an enormous expansion of the resultant forms of cognitive activity. A person capable of abstract thought reflects the external world more profoundly and completely and makes conclusions and inferences from perceived phenomena on the basis not only of his personal experience but also of schemes of logical thinking that objectively take shape in a fairly advanced stage of development of cognitive activity…”
So, a researcher asks the following questions in syllogistic form:
“Now, in the North, in Siberia, there is always snow. I told you that where there is snow the bears are white. What kind of bears are there in the North in Siberia?
‘I never travelled through Siberia. Tadzhibai-aka who died last year was there. He said that there were white bears there, but he didn’t say what kind.’
“We could scarcely find a better example of how the theoretical operation of inference from syllogisms is dealt with than the responses of this subject, who had only just arrived from the remoter regions of the Kashgar country. The subject refused to discuss any topics that went beyond his personal experience, insisting that ‘one could speak only of what one had seen,’ and failing to accept the premises presented to him.”
The impossibility of moving these people out of their highly concrete existence and to see the abstract principles behind these tasks is amazing. There is lovely talk at one point of what are basically mathematics problems (if it is three miles to town A and four miles to town B, how far is it to town B from here if you have to go through town A first?) They can do the simple maths, generally, but if the towns are given real names and the distances given didn’t correspond to the actual distances between the towns then everything comes crashing down and no answer is obtained.
I found this book virtually impossible to put down – it really is well worth whatever effort is involved in your finding it and reading it. Laria writes beautifully, truly beautifully – in clear and ‘kind’ sentences, unlike Vygotsky, how can be very difficult at times. He writes like someone with something important to say and that he wants to make sure you will understand. Worth more than five stars, to be honest.
But somewhere at the back of my mind I’ve been thinking about Luria. I learnt of this book from reading a book on research (which I’ll get to reviewing at some stage) and he has been troubling me (although only at the back of my mind, really). The book on research mentions this book as an exemplary example of social research. It would be hard to overstate this. This really is a fantastic book. The fact it was a bit hard to get my hands on probably made it all the more interesting in a way – but it has given me lots to think about.
I’ve written about Vygotsky before (Lev Vygotsky: Revolutionary Scientist) and Luria was involved in Vygotsky’s school. Vygotsky is very trendy (particularly at Melbourne Uni) although, admittedly, much more last year than he has proven to be this year. Mostly people were interested in his Zones of Proximal Development. But he also had ideas about the social nature of cognitive development – and it is these that I’ve been thinking about lately and that have made reading this book important.
To have a theory of cognitive development you need a kind of ladder in your head. You need to know that Kind A cognitive behaviour is of a lower type than Kind B. You need some idea of what you can do, given someone at Kind A level, to move your student towards the Kind B level.
This fits with the Bernstein and Bourdieu concern I have because if you can say that one kind of cognitive behaviour is, in fact, at a lower level to another kind of cognitive behaviour then teaching makes sense – that is, learning makes more sense than just being about show and ostentation.
In the 1930s in the Soviet Union there were all of those republics down near Turkey that end in –stan. One of them was Uzbekistan and Luria headed off there to do some research on the locals. Here were a group of people who were mostly illiterate and essentially feudal peasants. They were being placed in a kind of time machine and raced forward a couple of centuries.
Marxism holds that we are products of our social environment. Not just a little bit, but entirely products of that environment. Luria and Vygotsky took Marx at his word. They said that it should be possible to see real and predictable differences in how people think given the fact they are from socially more backward (less developed) cultures. That is, as Luria puts it, “some mental processes cannot develop apart from the appropriate forms of social life.”
He goes on to say what a rare opportunity has been offered him to do this research, “Psychology has made few attempts to deal with this problem, partly because of the infrequency of occasions when an investigator can observe how the restructuring of social systems has brought about rapidly changing forms of consciousness…”
The point being that, “We hypothesised that people with a primarily graphic-functional reflection of reality would show a different system of mental process from people with a predominantly abstract, verbal, and logical approach to reality.” (By graphic-functional, he just means that these people are fixated with concrete thinking, that they think ‘practically’, but rarely ‘theoretically’)
So, off he goes with other researchers and a series of brilliantly clever tests.
One of the debates that comes up from time to time is whether or not people see colours differently based on the language community they come from – this is particularly interesting if people come from language groups with different names for colours. For example, we have light and dark blue (but both are ‘blue’), whereas languages like Russian and French have quite different words for these two colours – and so they are seen as two colours in those language communities, rather than our one colour and two shades. However, few people in any language community is likely to have more than say 20 words they are likely to use to define colours. After you get through red, blue, green, yellow and so on you are probably going to start struggling. I’m taking it as read that people who can tell the difference between puce, burgundy and scarlet are basically oddities (if not actually wankers).
Luria’s test was to show people a series of coloured pieces of cloth and to ask them to group them according to the colours. Some people found this task quite easy (those schooled in the standard names we have for colours) who could arrange the colours according to those names and intensity – dark red, red, pink, white and so on. Others – a group of illiterate women in particular – simply said it couldn’t be done. And why? Well, they grouped the colours not on any abstract scheme of colour names, but rather according to what the colours reminded them of in the real world. I need to quote this:
“The group of ichkari women, however, presented us with an entirely different system. As a rule, the instruction to divide the colours into groups created complete confusion and called forth responses such as, ‘It can’t be done,’ ‘None of them are the same, you can’t put them together,’ ‘They’re not at all alike,’ or ‘This is like calf’s-dung, and this is like a peach.’ The women usually began by putting different skeins together, then attempted to explain their colour groups but shook their heads in perplexity and failed to complete the task.”
It is really important to see what is happening here. The women are not saying, ‘oh yes, nice pink, that will go with the hot pink over there and that will work well with the red’. They are saying, ‘this one looks like a peach and that one looks like cow dung – well, they don’t go together, clearly – hmm, none that look like cream, what to do?’ They don’t have an abstract scheme for colours, they have a highly practical understanding of colours as they appear in their daily world.
This is a hurdle that comes to haunt these people time and time again. Often the women grouped the colours by their intensity – so the dark reds, blues and greens were all together, but the light colours of these same colours were in different piles. But invariably these schemas would fall apart for one reason or another.
The researchers tried much the same with geometrical shapes and asked the peasants to group those. There were triangles and squares, but some constructed of lines and some of dashes and some of dots. These would invariably be grouped according their resemblance to concrete objects – a square might look like a watch (particularly one constructed by a series of dots – as these would represent the hours on the face) and a square made of solid lines may be a glass. These would then never be put into the same category. Even when the researcher gave hints and more.
Perhaps the most fascinating of all, though, was the work with optical illusions. When we look at an optical illusion – like those ones where the same size circle is placed in the middle of either a series of small or big other circles – we imagine that every human being would look at these in exactly the same way and be ‘fooled’ in the same way. These experiments showed that this was not the case: “It turned out that optical illusions are not universal. … The number of cases (where people saw the illusion) dropped proportionately in groups whose educational qualifications were lower. Thus the data clearly show that optical illusions are linked to complex psychological processes that vary in accordance with socio-historical development.”
The researchers then did interesting things with seeing how well people would be able to categorise objects. This really was mind-blowing. Essentially, they were playing that Sesame Street game where they sing, ‘One of these things is not like the other ones’. The objects presented were an ax, a saw, a hammer and a log. (I presume no one needs to be told the log is the odd one out), people invariably said they all belonged together and none could be taken away (the logic being that a tool is no use without something to work it on, so the log was needed too) The researchers then spoke about a mystery person who had done the test before and was crazy enough to have suggested the log might be the odd one out. I will quote some of the reported conversations this provoked from the illiterate peasants:
“But one fellow picked three things – the hammer, saw and hatchet – and said they were alike.
‘A saw, a hammer and a hatchet all have to work together. But the log has to be there too!”
Why do you think he picked those three things and not the log?
‘Probably he’s got a lot of firewood, but if we’ll be left without firewood, we won’t be able to do anything.’
True, but a hammer, a saw and a hatchet are all tools.
‘Yes, but even if we have tools, we still need wood – otherwise, we can’t build anything.’”
I find that a particularly fascinating exchange. What is most fascinating about it is the fact that the peasant is incapable of thinking outside of the practical situation created. What is also amazing is that their language ever developed a word like ‘tools’ if people were unable to distinguish that level of abstraction. Vygotsky’s point is that the language may have this word because those further up the pecking order would have been able to deal more in abstractions, but to the peasants words would actually have much more concrete meanings – they would not really be the basis of abstract categories as they are for us, but have meaning that were much more fluid and much more tied to the practical situations the peasants found themselves in. In some cases ‘food’ is also seen as a tool as a man can’t work without a full stomach.
Of the illiterate peasants some 80% of them were never able to do any of the tests in a way that showed they ‘got’ the abstract category idea, they always grouped according to the practical principle of a task or a use – if a concrete story could be made to group the elements then all of the elements of the story became part of the category. Of those who had had even a little schooling, but were barely literate 70% were able to form the correct categorical principle – of those more literate 100% were able to.
One of the things that is said about this, which I’ve found remarkably interesting, is that, “it is far more difficult to establish a resemblance between objects” than difference between objects. This is actually obvious when you think about it, but a remarkable observation all the same. Asking someone to tell you why two things are different is a ‘concrete task’. All of the differences are apparent and there in front of you. However, asking someone to tell you why two different things are similar is infinitely harder. You need to be able to have abstract categories in which to link the objects to so as to point out their similarities.
People also found it impossible to explain things – when asked to imagine they had to tell someone what a car or the sun were to someone who had never seen either of them before they said that they would not be able to do such a thing – that personal experience was the only means open to people to understand anything.
Which brings me up to the point where I should stop – despite only having explained half of the book. The only other thing I will mention is syllogisms. This, again, needs to be quoted, as it is a deep and important philosophical point – so I’ll end just after this extended quote:
“Conceptual thinking involves an enormous expansion of the resultant forms of cognitive activity. A person capable of abstract thought reflects the external world more profoundly and completely and makes conclusions and inferences from perceived phenomena on the basis not only of his personal experience but also of schemes of logical thinking that objectively take shape in a fairly advanced stage of development of cognitive activity…”
So, a researcher asks the following questions in syllogistic form:
“Now, in the North, in Siberia, there is always snow. I told you that where there is snow the bears are white. What kind of bears are there in the North in Siberia?
‘I never travelled through Siberia. Tadzhibai-aka who died last year was there. He said that there were white bears there, but he didn’t say what kind.’
“We could scarcely find a better example of how the theoretical operation of inference from syllogisms is dealt with than the responses of this subject, who had only just arrived from the remoter regions of the Kashgar country. The subject refused to discuss any topics that went beyond his personal experience, insisting that ‘one could speak only of what one had seen,’ and failing to accept the premises presented to him.”
The impossibility of moving these people out of their highly concrete existence and to see the abstract principles behind these tasks is amazing. There is lovely talk at one point of what are basically mathematics problems (if it is three miles to town A and four miles to town B, how far is it to town B from here if you have to go through town A first?) They can do the simple maths, generally, but if the towns are given real names and the distances given didn’t correspond to the actual distances between the towns then everything comes crashing down and no answer is obtained.
I found this book virtually impossible to put down – it really is well worth whatever effort is involved in your finding it and reading it. Laria writes beautifully, truly beautifully – in clear and ‘kind’ sentences, unlike Vygotsky, how can be very difficult at times. He writes like someone with something important to say and that he wants to make sure you will understand. Worth more than five stars, to be honest.
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Reading Progress
| 04/29/2011 | page 88 |
|
50.0% | "This book is beyond fascinating. I'll finish it tomorrow at the State Library: “He is then given the series finger-mouth-ear-eye and told that three objects are found on the head, the fourth on the body. ‘You say the finger isn’t needed here. But if a fellow is missing an ear, he can’t hear. All these are needed, they all fit in. If a man’s missing a finger, he can’t do a thing, not even move a bed.” Gosh!" |
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May 01, 2011 05:31pm
Trevor, can I repost your review to another forum? I sometimes join a reading group that studies and discusses various books covering cognition, and I'm sure many would like to hear about this.
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I'd be delighted. I really am annoyed with this review because it is so long and still didn't cover all of the important material in the book. The bit that has annoyed me most that I didn't mention is that he also points out that when they tried to get people to talk about themselves those with limited or no education found the task almost impossible to even understand. Asking questions like, 'what are your negative traits and what would you improve about yourself if you could' - were answered in a bewildered silence or with statements like, "I would like to have more land or perhaps just better clothes." Luria presents this as an interesting counter to Dualism and 'cognito ergo sum'. Sorry - need to quote this now I've started:“As our observations showed, the task of analysing one’s own psychological features or subjective qualities went beyond the capabilities of a considerable proportion of our subjects. In general, subjects in the first group failed the task. As a rule, they either refused to name positive or negative qualities in themselves or dealt with the question by describing concrete and material aspects of their lives. Sometimes they pointed to having ‘bad neighbours’ as one of their ‘shortcomings,’ or, in other words, they ascribed the undesirable characteristics to other people in their environment. They frequently found it easier for them to characterise other people than to characterise themselves.”
And later he talks about those who were (what we might call) properly self-reflective:
“As a rule, this type of self-examination was particularly pronounced for subjects who involved themselves in collective life, took part in kolkhoz meetings, and whose behaviour was evaluated by others. The increasing role of social evaluation, under whose influence self-evaluation takes shape, comes to be more and more predominant.”
What is most interesting about this book - besides the number of times I had to stop reading to shake my head and say 'get out of here' - is that it forces the reader to question things they might (or at least I always had) think were merely universal human traits. We are more than happy to think that cognition develops from child to adult - the idea that cognition may have been quite different due to earlier levels of social development is somewhat harder to accept (it certainly seems somewhat less than properly 'PC'). These studies into the cognitive abilities of pre-literate peoples have really struck me profoundly.
So, yes, please, share away.
This is a really lovely review. I would need to read the book to make a great deal of sense, I suspect, but I kept wondering about lower and higher levels, and whether the people who measured things against practical realities were 'lower' or just different. (Back to the influence of metaphor at the most fundamental level of understanding.) You seem to find some of their responses so fascinating and, judging by your tone, delightful, that I suspect it's the latter. But it also pulled me up in several places because in my own teaching, quite often I get responses that sound not dissimilar to some of these, and I can never understand what's going on -- for example, people who can't comment on their own weaknesses, except in terms of not having a car, or something like that.
And the fact that it's harder to find similarities between things than differences. You said that was obvious when you think about it, but it isn't obvious to me at all. But now I've got to review that essay I set people which obliges them to compare and contrast a story and a poem. Actually, my students are better at finding similarities, often, than at commenting on fundamental (one is a poem, one is in prose) differences.
But then I do that exercise (back to de Bono) where if you say 'Find 5 similarities' people will find precisely five. And the same for 'differences'. At least sometimes I do that. And then tell them I only want them to write about the interesting similarities or differences.
I said this at the beginning but I'll say it again: I DID enjoy this review.
In some ways I think the higher and lower is the standard metaphor where what is profane is lower what is etherial is higher - that of the body as against that of the mind. Bourdieu makes the same point about 'just different' - but I'm not sure. I do think abstraction allows a person to be able to think abstractly which gives insights that are unavailable to those who can't think in that way. I've gone back to read some Vygotsky - and starting here with this book has helped, as I can see where he is coming from more now. I also thought about 'compare and contrast' - I wonder if the students 'compare' based on strongly formed concepts (I know that sounds like I've just loaded the dice, but I don't mean to). What I mean is - in these experiments above the women would group things on loose concepts only to be lead astray as they went on. They might have coloured geometrical shapes in front of them and they might start off grouping all the triangles, only to then add squares (following the straight lines as the organising principle) then hexagons (more straight lines) which might then lead to circles and then them thinking, oh God, how did we get here, everything is in the same group. Vygotsky says young kids do this quite a lot.The more I thought about this the more I thought that most of academic learning is about learning to think in abstract concepts, outside of experience - one thing Bourdieu is certainly right about is that this is not easy, whether it is just hard for the sake of being hard, I'm not so sure.
Thanks for commenting Nell - I worry with these long and involved reviews that no one will bother with them. This is one of those books I dearly wanted to tell the whole world about and felt almost sure no one would actually read the damn thing. I'm delighted both you and Richard have found it interesting enough to comment on.
There must be a ladder here too Nell, I think, or else how to explain:Shall I compare thee to a summer's day?
As Shakespeare then spends the rest of the poem not comparing at all, but contrasting. I've just read over Don Paterson's thoughts on this sonnet too. Hmm... Nothing is ever easy or straight-forward.
The flip side to all this is whoever that philosopher was who said to a group of young women that there were no two things in the world that are identical, which only encouraged them to spend the rest of the afternoon in the garden looking for two identical leaves.
Which reminds me of the hours I spent as a child looking for (and finding) four leaved clovers. Not that this is relevant.
Hume? This excellent review reminded me of Foucault's account of the emergence of common nouns and the somewhat absurd fact that without common nouns we would have no sense of anything but individual existence--which happens to be the true state of nature (what Hume, if it was Hume, asserted). Only the individual does exist. Common nouns, the idea they contain, are artificial but of course very useful.
At the start of the Order of Things he mentions a study of people with aphasia who can't systematically order coloured bits of material and I was dying to know if Foucault knew of this study. I suspect he would have been quite amused by it.
This is indeed fascinating - thank you for pointing me to it. And very clear, like your Vygotsky review!
I really love this book, Choupette. The research is so clever. There are times when there are transcriptions of the interactions between the researchers and the subjects when the frustration is so obvious you can feel them nearly screaming through the pages, "Look, look, it's green, GREEN, can't you see they're all GREEN!"
My God Trevor! How do you do it? Another fascinating review that makes me want to read the damn thing. Ditto your review of Thought and Language.The above comment about GREEN reminded me of a colorblind man I knew once. He had a very flashy, bright red sports car. He told me that he had thought it was black when he bought it, because thats what it looked like to him. I asked him about traffic lights and he said that unless it was the standard light with red on the top, yellow in the middle and green on the bottom (or running left to right as some of ours do) then he couldn't tell the difference and just had to rely on the other drivers as to who had the right of way. He drove like a maniac the couple of times I rode with him and I was always so relieved when we reached our destination.
With some books I feel like a kid in a lolly shop - I guess that excitement comes through.The first time I ever met anyone seriously colourblind I was on a camp where we had to bring our own things to eat off. Two brothers had brought plastic cups - one bright red and the other a mucky brown - and one of the brothers said the bright red one was his. This guy asked, "How do you tell them apart?" At first everyone thought he was joking and he quickly realised his mistake, but it was too late. I must have been about 13 - it had never occurred to me that colour blindness could be so extreme. It was like being told someone couldn't tell the difference between a square and a circle. But then, there is a hint in the name, isn't there?
Fascinating book and review, as usual, Trevor.Trevor wrote: "They don’t have an abstract scheme for colours, they have a highly practical understanding of colours as they appear in their daily world."
So what's eating at me at the moment is whether it's appropriate to establish a hierarchy for culturally-specific set definitions and groupings. I mean, it's one thing to propose analogies. If I say, "Assume the following objects/colors are alike because of certain trait(s); now get these other objects/colors to match up," then it seems that you might judge the capability of the people being tested (or at least the clarity of the instructions). However, if the question is open-ended, who is to say that we should expect or regard as superior a particular grouping by shade, by intensity, by relationship of reflective frequency, by associative category (cow dung, peach, night sky), or by anything else?
What should we say of children whose exposure is inherently more limited than that of an adult? More and more it seems to me that all we can reasonably expect is for people to perform to the level of the algorithms we give them... or they give themselves on the basis of their own exposure. We should establish evaluative hierarchies (prerequisites for courses or hiring) and thus devise training relevant to the goals we are trying to achieve and should not assume these to be universally equivalent. Is this too relativistic and accommodating?
