karen's Reviews > The Outsiders

The Outsiders by S.E. Hinton

by
45618
's review
Sep 07, 10

bookshelves: and-so-this-is-grad-school, why-yes-i-ya
Read from September 02 to 05, 2010

the outsiders is a book about a group of youthful greasers living in oklahoma, and about their struggles to exist in a society that seems designed to dismiss them.

oklahoma is also the name of a popular musical.

draw your own conclusions, or continue reading.

see, i don't know from oklahoma in the sixties. maybe that is a place where street toughs call their little brothers "honey" and "baby" and enjoy sunsets and stars and reading margaret mitchell aloud to one another and who recite robert frost in quiet moments. maybe they do gymnastics before what they call "skin fighting" with the local rival boys. maybe they cry and snuggle together in bed at night and hold each other through hard times.

not that there is anything wrong with that.

it just seems to be queer behavior for a gang of juvenile delinquents.


what?? no, i didn't mean queer like that. no, really, i just meant odd. but, now that you mention it. huh. yeah, it does seem a little queer. who knew that boys in leather could have a queer connotation??





and putting on tight t-shirts that show off every muscle before they go to meet the other boys? and making sure to fix their hair?? no, that's just what it says. in the book.

these are their modern-day equivalents

maybe this is just what happens when a teen girl writes this kind of material, tomboy or not. i had seen the movie before, so i knew it was about pretty boys fighting, but there is a lot more at work here, subtextually. i have also seen rumble fish, which is an awful movie based on another hinton book that is even more... musical, but is an excuse to look at this:



and how is tom waits in both movies?

but all of that is just me giggling.

what is more interesting, from a serious literary perspective is just an observation from reading this, the pigman, and revisiting the chocolate war and catcher in the rye for this portion of my young adult readers' advisory class which will meet this tuesday where we will discuss the "classics" of teen fiction. (and i know catcher wasn't specifically produced for a teen audience, but it is on the damn syllabus and if it makes you happier, i will call this "the teen in literature" instead)

in the fifties and sixties, there was seemingly more free-floating apprehension and fear: the a-bomb, the draft, various factors contributed to this fear of an imminent death beyond anyone's control. all this anxiety and fear of the establishment created a more pronounced sense of "us" and "them" that i think i blabbed on a little in the pigman review, but children were just treated like smaller adults, really. and the literature reflects this. all of these books seem to emphasize a value placed on the preservation of childhood innocence - staying gold, protecting a younger sister from the taint of phoniness, encouraging kids to act like kids and roller skate through the house and disregard the parental restrictions in this one safe place...

now, the boundaries are blurrier - girls are getting their periods at 8, and grown men in suits are playing video games on the subway. the distinctions are less clear. and a lot of teen fiction today is more escapist in nature, less didactic. teens don't need to be told to value their childhood anymore because, don't worry, it will never end.

peter pan FTW!!

this all means nothing, except it is something i noticed. sorry for blabbing on...

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Comments (showing 1-50 of 109) (109 new)


Jason McIntyre Nice! I do hope you enjoy it.


Joel yaaaaaaay! you'll be talking like a greaser all week.


Jason McIntyre And she'll refer to everyone as a 'soc'!


message 4: by Matt (new)

Matt First read this in 9th grade English. Our teacher was intimidating as hell, but she looked like Johnny Ramone so I loved her anyway.

Stay gold, Ponygirl.


karen it's so strange that i have never read this, and i had to wait for grad school to have it assigned to me. my poor, spotty education...


message 6: by Courtney (new)

Courtney I never read any of the classics for school. I think we got assigned outsiders in elementary school but i could just be remembering the movie. and knowing me back then i probably didn't read it.


message 7: by Lauren (new)

Lauren =) I live in Tulsa, where S.E. Henton was from, and the city The Outsiders is written around. It's funny that your reading it now, because today the Admiral Twin drive in burned down. ;[ The movie was filmed all over Tulsa, with lots of scenes there. Sad day for Tulsans and Outsiders fans...


karen holy shit!! oh, that is bullshit. i am sorry - that is just awful! it's such a shame when cool historic things are ruined. it wasn't socs, was it??


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio Ponyboy and Sodapop.

That is all.

P.S. The movie has a great cast of before they were famous actors. The Karate Kid is it in as one of the two kids with ridiculously untough names.


message 10: by Lauren (new)

Lauren haha... they don't know yet... but lets just go ahead and blame the socs....


Jasmine i didn't remember this book being that gay. I feel like I should reread it now.

Peter pan!!


karen they are just unlike any young gang members i have ever met.


Jasmine peter pan didn't act gay like that, he just played cowboys and indians


karen oh, no - i was just talking about peter pan because our culture refuses to grow up now - i never read peter pan so i don't know its gay-content.


Jasmine you don't have to read it I am obsessed enough for both of us


message 16: by Courtney (new)

Courtney oh man i thought S.E. Hinton was a guy.


message 17: by Lauren (new)

Lauren Nope. Susan Eloise Hinton. She still lives here in T-Town actually... She goes to TU football games a lot. =)


message 18: by Joel (new) - rated it 4 stars

Joel Man. I knew this was pretty gay (nttawwt) and said so in my review but I can believe I forgot all the snuggling and spooning. I guess because they were brothers I didn't want to go there. But yeah. It's the one point that makes it very obvious this was written by a girl.

Oh and courtney, she went by SE so you would think she was a guy, fearing no boys would read this kind of book if they knew it was written by a woman.


message 19: by Courtney (new)

Courtney oh ok. She succeeded in that. i never read it so i wouldn't have known what was in it.


karen here's an interesting fact: if you GIS "leather daddy" even with the strict safesearch feature on, you still get to see a lot of penis.

kids, you're welcome...


karen joel - yeah - i guess maybe i still had your review in my subconscious even though i voted for it the week before... it was there... bubbling....

but i am glad we agree.
totally gay.
(nttawwt)


message 22: by Greg (new)

Greg should nttawwt be nttiawwt instead? does it matter?

I still can't wrap my head around there being anything gay about the Outsiders, it is too entwined with Red Dawn for me.




message 23: by Joel (new) - rated it 4 stars

Joel not that there's anything wrong with that.


karen yeah, greg, contractions!!


message 25: by Greg (new)

Greg I stand corrected. My way is too clunky.


message 26: by Nissie (new)

Nissie Great review as usual, Karen! I just ordered this a couple of days ago. Why? I couldn't tell you, but I did.


message 27: by Lauren (new)

Lauren I think its funny that there are so many little queer-esque things in this book. But then again... I'm not... Fun Fact about Tulsa, Ok: It has the 3 largest gay population per capita in the US. Maybe S.E. Hinton was priming us for our future?

Also... because of all the looming backwoods country just a stone throw away... there are also TONS of homophobic rednecks. Makes for quite an event during the gay pride parades...


karen hmmmmm yukky rednecks are the modern day soc's - who would have imagined?


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio Homophobic rednecks?? Now I've heard of everything.

It's almost too banal to mention but it's so common for overtly tough guy, gay-basher types to "secretly" be in conflict with their own sexual desires. It's sad that they grow up in an environment that fosters this kind of projected self-hatred. It's something I see everyday now, working with extremely homophobic teenage boys and two openly bisexual boys among them. It's almost kind of weird seeing how textbook it all is. There's all kinds of stuff going on in the house on the Down Low.


message 30: by Joshua Nomen-Mutatio (last edited Sep 06, 2010 07:06am) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Joshua Nomen-Mutatio In other words: ganstas (i.e. toughs) are all secretly gay or bi. Luckily none of them have GR profiles.


karen oh, everyone is secretly gay.


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio

Shhhhhhhhh. This is supposed to be secret, y'all!

I dunno, I loathe my confining straightness. I'd love to be able to branch out (twss?) secretly or not. Where's my special interest group? Straights who wish to be bi. Regardless of the lyrical wisdom of Kurt Cobain I don't believe that everyone is gay. But there are most certainly plenty of secretly gay folks. And that's too bad.


Jasmine MyFleshSingsOut wrote: "

I dunno, I loathe my confining straightness. I'd love to be able to branch out (twss?) secretly or not. "


christopher hitchens can teach you how!


Jasmine it's a british thing. apparently all straight british men had sex with other men in high school and college.

although I think he is only straight sometimes, sometimes he is bi.


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio Oh yeah, I heard him talk about that in an interview the other day.

I've made my genuine attempts. It just doesn't work. I guess I'm stuck with these goddamn females.


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio I'm just waiting for someone to be the Ponyboy to my Sodapop. Someday...


karen well, don't lose hope, mfso...

maybe you are a late bloomer.


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio karen wrote: "maybe you are a late bloomer."

That's the hope.


Jasmine at least you tried.


karen be more gay!!

i am trying to be your life coach!! come on mfso, you can do it!


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio Ha! Enjoy fucking males, maggot!

You be my drill sergeant (twss)?


karen oh, i will make sure you get drilled, baby...


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio That's the answer.

What a great hucksterish career you could have teaching people to be more gay. I've got dibs on making the documentary about this weirdness.


karen i don't think anyone would fight you for them.


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio I have a sneaking suspicion that this project will never get off the ground.


karen this is why you aren't gay - laziness


Joshua Nomen-Mutatio Oh girl, you ca-razy...

Twist the knife, why dontcha.


message 49: by trivialchemy (new)

trivialchemy I'm gay for the idea of MFSO, but he's so physically repugnant I've never been able to act out on it.


karen awww mean!


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