Penny's Reviews > Fool Moon

Fool Moon by Jim Butcher
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Jan 14, 14

bookshelves: reviewed-books, werewolves, zombies-aliens-vampires-dinos
Read from June 03 to 06, 2010

Update 03-11-11(2): So my last update was hastily written, and in anger. Now that I've had time to cool off and think clearly I'm feeling bad. So here's another, less in-your-face way of saying it:

Warning: this review contains cheekiness. Please do not be offended or take this review too seriously as it is meant in jest. If you are a serious Dresden fan this review is probably not for you. So you should just read another review, k. Have a nice day. :)


Update 03-11-11: I've pretty much had it with you people. Apparently this review is "really offensive". But guess what? I'm not going to change it. It was written in jest.

What I am going to do is say that if Jim Butcher can write women as helpless little sex kittens and call it "noir-style", therefore OK, I can write a so-called "offensive" and "sexist" review, in jest, and still sleep at night. Got it?


I've spent a good portion of my married life wondering what in the heck is going on in my husband's head. To be honest, I just don't understand men in general. I don't get what motivates them to do what they do. I've been told that I'm over-thinking it, men aren't complicated. Apparently sex has a lot to do with the decisions they make.

I've spent a lot of time rejecting this idea, thinking it cannot possibly be true, at least not totally. Even my husband, man-child extraordinaire that he can be at times cannot be so basic, so primal. My husband is incredibly intelligent, has a wealth of knowledge stored up in that noggin of his. He's motivated by more then just sex... right???

Then, every once in a while, I go and read a book written by a man and I'm reminded that indeed, I have been over-thinking it. My husband, and all other men for that matter, are probably thinking about sex, or things of a sexual nature far more often than I could imagine.

When it comes to books written by men, more often than not the male characters describe women they encounter in a sexual manner. The descriptions don't even have to be dirty, in fact they usually aren't. But I still find it irritating when the most basic observations seem sexual. Besides, I simply cannot relate. When I see a man who is attractive I think, Wow! or something like that. But I don't wax poetic about his bazillion abs and how much I'd like to feel them pressed up against me, or whatever.

I tend to focus on how I feel when I'm with people. For instance my initial attraction to my husband had to do with the fact that he made me laugh and I felt comfortable around him. Looks didn't factor into the equation.

(For the record: I didn't find him particularly attractive, at least no more then the next guy. Plus, he used to dress like a friggin' hobo. Had it not been for his awesome personality, his sense of humor, I wouldn't have been interested. For this same reason I have a massive crush on Conan O'Brien, no joke. Conan is sexy, but I digress).

My point is: because I don't exactly understand men, how they think, and how I'm left feeling disappointed by the tiny bit that does seem to make sense, I tend to avoid books written by men.

That being said, I don't totally dislike this series. There is a lot of potential here.

Jim Butcher built a fascinating world with some interesting and, as far as I can tell, original rules about wizardry and other things supernatural. For instance, the MC, a wizard, cannot meet the eyes of another person without seeing into their soul, and they his. It's so strangely intimate I can't help but be intrigued by the idea. And he has this assistant named Bob, who is actually a spirit stuck in a human skull--he's kind of like a grimoire, codex and a computer mixed together, but even better. And I like the idea of a wizard solving supernatural crimes. I don't know, the concept totally seems to work for me.

Overall, I sort of like this series and plan on reading the third book, even though I felt Fool Moon, the second installment in the Dresden Files was incredibly boring. Why I found this book boring is anybody's guess since it dealt with werewolves, and I tend to like werewolf lore.

Even the romantic element in this book, though semi-interesting, sort of fell flat. Heck, the sex scene, which was actually quite tasteful, happened at a really odd time. And Dresden cried afterward, which, really, circumstances being what they were, made sense. But still.

Fine. I admit it. It turns out ultra-sensitive men make me uncomfortable. I mean, crying after sex? Really? Here's the deal, I was raised in a household full of boys. I have five older brothers. They didn't talk about their feelings and never cried in front of me, much--it has to be said: I'm not much of a crier. My dad was in the Marines for twenty years, he went to Vietnam. Both my parents are old-school and Hispanic to boot. Which brings me to my next point: even though I'm repelled by Harry Dresden's sensitive nature, I still find his old-school chivalrous manners appealing.

I know, I know--I'm (kind of) a fraud! I let everyone think I'm all about feminism, but I (secretly) like when men hold doors for me. Not because I can't do so myself--because I can and I do all the time--but because it's just nice when somebody does that sort of thing, ya know? And while I like my independence, and I'm a strong woman (both physically and emotionally) I've always liked men with protective instincts--notice I said protective, not controlling.

Basically, I like knowing someone's got my back. This is why I sort of like Harry, despite his sometimes-wussy ways.

You probably think I'm not being consistent, that my reasons for liking this series are not exactly rational. You know what? You're right. What can I say? I'm a woman. It's my prerogative to be inconsistent and irrational. And anyway, things could be much worse. I could be a man, thinking of little else but sex all the live-long day. ;)
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Reading Progress

06/04/2010 "Audiobook. About halfway through. It's definitely not as good as the first book. Who'd of thought werewolves could be so boring?" 6 comments
06/05/2010 "I've heard, from multiple sources, Fool Moon is the worst book in the Dresden Files series. I believe it. This book is really boring. But I will finish this book. I. Will."
06/06/2010 "IT'S OVER! Thank goodness. It was boring in the beginning, then it got slow. Then, sort of confusing. And then, three-quarters through, things picked up a little. The end was okay. Overall, this book wasn't horrible, but it wasn't good either. It just was. P.S. I will be going to the trouble of writing a review for this book. I have a few things to say about it (some bad, some good)." 2 comments

Comments (showing 1-50 of 53) (53 new)


message 1: by Tatiana (new)

Tatiana LOL. Excellent review. And yes, men in fact are very simple creatures and think about sex almost 100% of the time. I know, I asked my husband straight a while ago, so I don't have any illusions on that account.


message 2: by Bry (new)

Bry I am all about Conan O'Brien! Go Team CoCo! Oh and your last 3 paragraphs describe me to a T!

Fantastic review! I have had this sitting on my shelf for quite some time waiting for me to get around to reading it but I have been ignoring it. I think I need to bump it up the list though!


Penny @ Tatiana: I know if I ask my husband, he'll be honest and straightforward. It's just, I don't want to ruin the illusion. I like to pretend my husband is better then most men. (I know. I'm pathetic.)

@ Bry: I'm totally Team Coco. I've loved him since I was fifteen years old.

About this series: I'm not sure you want to read it. I'm still in a weird place about it. I've been told to push past the fourth book and THAT'S when the series gets really good. Apparently it's totally worth it since there are already twelve books to the series, with more to come. Anyway, I'll let you know if you should try.

P.S. I get the feeling that the way I feel about the series thus far is the exact same way men feel when they try to read a Nicholas Sparks book--not that I've ever read one, but I can imagine *shudders*

@ Ryan: Question: Is Michael in the first book? Because I seriously cannot remember him being there and now I'm really irritated. As far as I know, he was first introduced at the beginning Grave Peril.

I'm 3/4 of the way through Grave Peril, and I like it much better then Fool Moon. That being said, that book is so disjointed. It's bugging me because I keep thinking I accidentally skipped a couple pages, which is impossible since I'm listening to it, not reading it.

Also, I was surprised that Dresden and Susan actually became a couple. Their relationship seemed so shallow, of mutual convenience, I didn't really see it becoming anything. I'm shocked he's suddenly in love with her.


message 4: by Bry (new)

Bry The 4th book?? Ug. I just don't think you should have to read 4 books of crap to get to the good stuff.


Jeremiah, escapist ...as a man I am truly offended by your statement. You are a utterly sexist person. I can think of many many men who are not influenced by sex. This is a completely sexist stereotype. I don't have thoughts of sex 24/7! I don't even really think of sex. If I showed this to any other male that I know, they would be... flabbergasted. I am shocked at you.


message 6: by Lorelei (last edited Oct 25, 2010 02:18AM) (new)

Lorelei I'm with Jeremiah. Not all men are like that. Trust me. If my husband read that stuff, he would laugh. If *I* said those things to him, he would be hurt and upset. And believe me, I've cross examined him until the cows came home. Looking at porn at one point in our relationship (those days are long gone) made him throw up in disgust - also, he realized how it made *me* feel and as a result, it also made him feel worse, because he's a very loving, empathetic soul. On top of that, he's too busy supporting and thinking about his two girls - his wife and his daughter - to be fantasizing, anyway. Writers might have more time to do so if they choose, since they can tell whatever stories they'd like. Anyway, I'm glad a man spoke up about this. It's okay for women to have standards instead of making such generalizations, or else we simply run the risk of encouraging men to follow their most basic, animal urges (which women have too)... we've evolved and are quite capable of controlling both our thoughts and actions. Heck, with practice, it becomes our nature, and the opposite becomes unnatural.


Christopher Humphries We also think about food and our own interests, which my or may not include a woman :)

I felt like I was hearing a commentary on your understanding of the world than a review of the book. Is this a blog post or something?


message 8: by Lorelei (last edited Oct 25, 2010 02:36AM) (new)

Lorelei Very true; I think being well-rounded and having many interests, especially ones that take one out of oneself, tends to help one steer clear of being a stereotype. Anyway, yeah... sorry to barge in (since I haven't read the book).


Akoss I'm sorry, your review wasn't very objective in my opinion.


message 10: by Penny (last edited Jan 22, 2011 07:03PM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny I'm offended you people are offended. Kidding! See, because I like to kid around. You people think my review is 100% serious? Really? Wow, nerds.

EMOTICONS 101: I don't know if anyone has ever explained emoticons to you people, but when people use this: ;) it's because they're just fooling around. Just sayin'.

Otherwise, I would say my review is quite objective. Maybe it wasn't helpful--to you. But I stated why I'm not a major fan of Jim Butcher's writing. And yes, he does describe all women in a sexual manner. Does he do so in a dirty or necessarily demeaning way? No. It's just not the way I see women because I am a woman. He's a man. Men are more visual then women are. Men and women are different. I'm not making this crap up.

So basically, I find it difficult to get into the narrative. It just doesn't totally work for me. Does that mean Jim Butcher cannot write? Well, if I were to base my opinion off the first three books in this series alone, I'd say no. Because the first three books aren't well written overall. Luckily I gave Jim Butcher another chance and picked up Summer Knight. THAT BOOK is well written compared to books one, two, and three.

Moving on...

Yes, Harry Dresden is quite sensitive. Sometimes too sensitive. That's okay. Not my cuppa, but that's okay.

This series has a lot going for it, a lot of potential. Clearly there is a major fan base. Clearly a lot of Butcher's fans take life too seriously. But whatever. You people be offended. I don't care. I was joking. If you're offended, then move on. Don't write a massive post telling me YOU aren't the "stereotypical" male, so therefore my review--even though it's meant in good fun--is wrong.

Why is this review getting so much attention anyway? What? You people read through several pages of reviews to get to this one? Or does my review have so many votes (just 6--ha!) that it's one of the first reviews posted?

Hey, I've got an idea. How about all you people who HATE this review just vote up other, "less offensive" and "less sexist" and "more objective", reviews. That way you won't ever have to see this review every time you decide to check this page.

Because I'm such a nice person, I'll start. I'll vote for 10 other reviews. You people can join in any time you want. Or you can just write back and complain about what a horrible person I am. By-the-way, I'm pretty much laughing right now. This is the only time I've ever been accused of being, what was it? Oh yes, "offensive" and "sexist".


Penny Lorelei wrote: "I'm with Jeremiah. Not all men are like that. Trust me. If my husband read that stuff, he would laugh. If *I* said those things to him, he would be hurt and upset. And believe me, I've cross examin..."


Ever heard of paragraphs? As in, breaking your post up into more then one? It's not hard to do. Just press the space bar every once in a while.

Also how's your reading comprehension these days? Because this is what my review says (additional emphasis added by me):

"Then, every once in a while, I go and read a book written by a man and I'm reminded that indeed, I have been over-thinking it. My husband, and all other men for that matter, are probably thinking about sex, or things of a sexual nature far more often then I could imagine."


Braxton three things:

1)whether you were kidding or not, you still made sexist generalizations about men. The fact that you were kidding doesn't make it any less offensive.

2)No one like a grammar Nazi. Correcting someones spelling and grammar just makes you look like an asshole who doesn't have a valid argument.

3)Obviously you aren't very familiar with noir-style detective stories. The way Butcher describes women in the Dresden books is a throwback to the noir style. Noir tropes can be found all throughout this series. This was the authors intent.


message 13: by Penny (last edited Mar 10, 2011 09:45PM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny Seriously? Braxton, just vote up other reviews if you don't like mine. And again, not to be a--I'm sorry, what was it?--nazi--are you effing kidding me by the way? I'd say comparing me to a nazi is far more offensive then my "sexist generalizations against men".

Dude, I get your application of the word here--I'm not a moron--but still, comparing anyone to a nazi who isn't an actual hitler-worshipping nazi is overkill and offensive. Nazis wanted to eradicate a whole entire race of people and take over the world.

Moving on...

Sorry, I was just voicing my irritation because somebody didn't: 1) comprehend what I wrote in the first place, therefore 2) goes after me due to their lack of comprehension (again, their fault). 3) Can't break up their rant into paragraphs when they attack me.

Seriously, my original review says: "My husband, and all other men for that matter, are probably thinking about sex, or things of a sexual nature far more often then I could imagine."

By the way, does Steven King write noir-style detective stories? How but Grisham? Dan Brown? Nope? Yeah, I thought so. Funny, their male protagonists describe women in a sexual manner too. Think maybe it's not just the style of writing then?


message 14: by Cassidy (new)

Cassidy First of all he isn't the first person to use the term "grammar nazi". And I do believe you know this because of the fact that you have proven at least you are literate.While you claim to have been joking which I am not calling bullshit on but I will say that when you "joke" about something like this you run a risk. First of all your "joke" was offensive. That is why people are commenting. If you didn't want people to take it personally and be hurt by it you should have pointed out in your review that you were simply joking but you didn't. If it's really how you feel you have every right to post it whether we like it or not. But you posted it and this is the result. I would also like to say and you can tear me apart if you wish, but in my opinion men differ from each other as much as women do. I don't begin to suggest you and I are alike just because we are women. I don't see the point in doing it to men. I grew up in a family of mostly boys and they vary in their personality's and priorities. And while some men I have known have thought about sex constantly. Many think of it hardly ever and it will also vary with age. Some men and women think of nothing but sex but not all. If someone had written a review generalizing you as a woman. Stating all women are a certain way then you would be offended and would comment as well. I know I would. I would feel it was very insensitive and would say something. As I pointed out you wrote and posted this. Stating an intense opinion or "joke" of this nature does not go unnoticed. Belittling people just makes them more angry.


message 15: by Penny (last edited Mar 11, 2011 08:26AM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny Clearly I've heard the term throughout my lifetime. I'd have to be living in a hole had I not. I'm talking about the general overuse, misapplication of the word has got to stop. It is offensive.

Ever notice how it's used all the time, and never appropriately? These days EVERYONE is a nazi. Everyone is hitler. Dude, those people were the worst. Those people murdered people for being Jewish, mentally retarded, gay, and so forth. If you're going to use the word, at all, use it when it's called for, otherwise it loses its meaning. Thus people like you are going around defending it's use, like it's okay. Much more offensive and ignorant then my review, don't you think?

By the way, last night, I added a disclaimer of sorts. I'll tone it down, if you insist, but I'll do it later today when I have time.


message 16: by Tatiana (last edited Mar 11, 2011 04:51AM) (new)

Tatiana Good grief, my first encounter with rabid Butcher fans. Clearly they are as bad as Twi fans, only use longer words.

Hang in there, Penny!


message 17: by Braxton (last edited Mar 11, 2011 08:59AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Braxton *sarcasm* Fine, since you got all butthurt and protested so much, I retract my use of the term grammar Nazi. I apologize for comparing you to a member of the National Socialist party. Obviously you weren't alive during the holocaust, and therefore didn't kill any minorities. Please forgive me for my grievous offense. How does "grammar bitch" sound instead? *end sarcasm*

Joking aside, It's fine that you didn't like the book, people like different things, and I'm sure that your intent was not to offend anyone. The problem with your review is that regardless of your intent, it was still offensive. It is the same as if someone reviewed the book and said "it's ridiculous that Murphy is a cop, everybody knows that women belong in the kitchen", and then said that they were kidding.

As far as the other writers that you mentioned, you are right that they tend to describe women in more sexual terms. I wasn't talking about any writer other than Butcher. I can't say why the other writers do it, but in Butcher's case it is just one of the many tropes of noir fiction that he uses. He has gone on record about this. If it is that offensive to you, then I would recommend that you steer clear of his books, and probably books written in men in general. You seem to have a sizable chip on your shoulder regarding the depiction of women in fiction. Because of that you probably subconsciously look for things and find things when they aren't really there.


message 18: by Penny (last edited Mar 11, 2011 09:26AM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny Sure you can call me that as long as I can call you Braxton the Dresden-loving troll (yeah, I'm well aware you and Cassidy have been harassing other people who don't share your view of this series).

Moving on:

In my review I was talking about Butcher AND other male writers. It's all there in black and white. But whatever, that's fine, let's just talk about Butcher.

Why is it, no matter what's going on, Dresden mentions the body shape of any woman in his general vicinity? There are times in which he's almost dead yet he conveniently finds the time to take note of cup-size and the like. Just seems a little, I don't know, ridiculous. But whatever, that's just 'noir-style', right?

And the love scene in this book? Ill-timed and awkward.


message 19: by Heather (new)

Heather What fresh hell is this? T, I'm thinking Butcher fans are worse than twi fans because they have this whole elitist thing going on.

Cassidy & Braxton:
It’s great that you love Butcher; and I don't say that with a hint of sarcasm. I truly think it’s a wonderful thing to find an author that you can delight in. With that said, Penny does not delight in Butcher. I'm sure if you scroll through her read shelf; you will find authors that hold a special place in her heart that you thought were atrocious. You know why, because reading is subjective. An author can create a fabulous world, filled with unique characters, but that character won't be likeable to everyone. You liked Dresden, Penny found him to be sexist. It happens. I think you've both made your point that you don't share her opinion, so what more do you want? For her to agree with you? To attempt to shame her into conceding to your point of view by calling her a grammar nazi? Truly, beyond voicing your displeasure of her review, why exactly are you posting? You are trying to make yourself come across as more intelligent than Penny, I’m sure, or trying to portray an image that you are more accepting of the world around you than she, but in truth, you are making yourselves sound like pompous a$$hats who are throwing a fit because someone doesn’t agree with you. Get over it.


Braxton Penny,
I haven't been harassing anyone. If you notice the content of Sira's review it was much the same as yours. I was defending Butcher, because he isn't being sexist. I could care less if you don't like the books, I just don't like when people hypocritically are sexist against men while accusing a man of being sexist against women. Since when is defending something you like being a troll. You idiots on the internet these days say that anyone who disagrees with your opinion is a troll.

"One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument"

That is the urban dictionary's definition of a troll. If anything you are closer to that than I am. I haven't done anything but disagree with you. Sure I called you a grammar nazi in my first post, but I was annoyed, because this is a discussion on the internet, not english class. I haven't tried to start an argument, I was simply pointing out how I felt about your review, and trying to help you understand the author's intent.


message 21: by Cassidy (new)

Cassidy First of all I didn't even talk about the book. In fact I have yet to read it and doubt I will because it's not my type of thing. I wrote what I wrote because of your sexist comments in the review. As far as the whole grammar Nazi stuff, you know what it means. And you know that Braxton did not come up with the term. Obviously you like to address things like this or the woman who didn't part her paragraphs to avoid talking about the real issue at hand. The only reason I commented is because Braxton is my husband and showed me the review. My drive to respond was that I have 4 brothers and have a son on the way so I felt a need to defend men. I addressed this in my response. But instead of acknowledging what I really was saying you assumed my comments were based upon the book. If a man was saying sexist things against women of course I would defend women. If you had only stated that the author was sexist I would not have said a word. But you didn't you said all men were like this. Stop getting off topic and addressing things that have nothing to do with the argument. Braxton is not suggesting you murdered Jews. But you know this and it seems ridiculous to imply that much.


Penny Cassidy, you lack comprehension skills. Therefore I'm done with you. Blocked. Deleted.


message 23: by Penny (last edited Mar 11, 2011 02:04PM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny Also now that my warning is posted, and has been for several hours, clearly letting people know my review is tongue in cheek, you think you could get off my back? Because, remember, you're posting comments to my review, troll.

Dude, urban dictionary? Good job researching. Your google skillz are phenomenal.


Braxton You just showed your true colors by blocking Cassidy. She called you out, and you obviously couldn't defend yourself, and you blocked her. Way to stand up for yourself and not be a coward. I just want to point out one thing you call me a troll, but you are the one who started this argument. I'm done with this. There obviously can't be any kind of intelligent discussion between us. I just want to say one last time, blocking someone or deleting their comments is the most cowardly thing one can do in an argument. You shouldn't say things if you aren't prepared to defend what you say.


message 25: by Penny (last edited Mar 11, 2011 02:05PM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny I can defend myself. I already have, Braxton. I wrote this review in jest. She knows this. As to the whole nazi-thing I explained my feelings on the overuse/misuse of the word (therefore losing its meaning--every horrible thing connected with it--altogether), no need to repeat myself yet again. Oh, wait, I just did. If you still don't get it that's not my problem.

Besides Cassidy hasn't read the book and neither, from what I can tell, have you. But whatever, why is she fighting your battles for you anyway? Grow up. You chose to read a two star review of a book you seem to like (yet not enough to actually rate), get butt hurt over it, called me an ASSHOLE, a bitch, started throwing around the word 'nazi'. In short, YOU'VE BEEN HARASSING ME.

All I've done is defend myself, defend my review, asked you not to compare me to a nazi, (again, I understand the phrase 'grammar nazi', I just find it offensive. Because you do not just backs up my argument), posted a little warning before my review and I called you a troll. Clearly I'm the bigger monster.

Whatever. You're a moron. I'm done with you. Blocked.


Penny Blocking irritating people isn't cowardly. It's common sense.


Braxton She isn't fighting any battles for me, and I have just started this series. I'm currently reading the second book. Thus making it even more ridiculous that you called me a Dresden loving troll. And you didn't defend yourself. You completely ignored the part where she pointed out that when you don't have an argument you complain about grammar or complain about the word "nazi". Instead of addressing what people say you dodge the criticism.


message 28: by Braxton (last edited Mar 11, 2011 02:18PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Braxton and apparently when all else fails you block people.

Thanks for proving my point. :)


message 29: by Anthony (new)

Anthony It used to be if you wrote scandalously about religion you were censored and your art or literature was considered unenlightened and bad. Now we all have to write within a politically correct strait-jacket so as not to hurt anyone's feelings and if you don't you are dismissed as being unenlightened.


message 30: by Kristi (last edited Mar 11, 2011 03:19PM) (new)

Kristi Braxton= red neck bully!!!!! Braxton you are being a jerk and you know it. Get over yourself and get a life. Penny is free to express her thoughts and feeling on a author and or book. That is what is nice about as website like this. She has not sought you out to be her friend on here and for this should not have to worry about whether she is offending you or not. You are nothing to her so back the heck off. She has not broken any laws, but you however are getting very close to being considered a stalked!!!!


message 31: by Pam (new)

Pam Penny- I would marry you if we weren't both straight! I love you, and your reviews make me giggle. I appreciate your post, jest or not, because well- my hubby is one of those that I am sure fit well within your comments. I wanna read this series, just cause there are so many books... I love the idea of 12 books. Especially about magic, werewolves, and the likes. Have you read more of them yet?


Penny Hey Pam, good to know not everyone is offended by this review. It is a good series. What I mean is, it has a good foundation, but the plotting in the first three books is pretty atrocious. A lot happens. Too much happens. Harry Dresden is thisclose to death for a large portion of this particular installment of the series and book three is pretty forgettable despite the fact a lot happens in it.

That said, I like book four, Summer Knight. Really well paced, good story line, amusing bits. Overall a satisfying read. I'm slowly working my way through book five right now. Though it's not as irritating as books 1-3 it isn't as good as book four.

Why have I invested so much time an effort into a series that, so far, has struckout more often then not? I've been told it's smooth sailing from book six on. Sure I could have skipped some books, but then I wouldn't know what was going on every now and then and that would bug me.

You should try reading the first book, see if it interests you.


message 33: by Cory (new)

Cory Wow. And I thought trolls only existed in YA. I followed this from your review on the Duff, and I have to say that I'm amazed that some people don't know what satire, humor, and sarcasm are.

I bet they actually thought Swift meant that poor people should eat their children. *sigh* They'd probably take offense at that classism in that. You're tempting me to go back to my snarky reviewing ways.


Seamus Sweeney Hey,although I don't agree with everything you wrote,I really enjoyed your review,maybe you should be a writer!


message 35: by Kiri (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kiri You put words to much of what I've been thinking as I've read the first two Dresden novels. Yay, I'm not alone!


message 36: by B (new) - rated it 4 stars

B Webb I am the first to agree that Harry Dresden's first two outings are not Jim Butcher's finest work. I also tend to agree with many of your observations about the two-dimensional portrayal of women on the books. That said, the series really does improve - a lot. And these were his first two novels. Put in that context, I really enjoyed the "working mage" aspect of the narrator, one which I have not encountered before in an urban fantasy dominated by vampires and the occasional werewolf. It kept me interested enough to buy and read the rest of the series so far. However, the less said about the abortive cable TV series, the better. Stick with the books, and take heart. They get much more complex and interesting, as does Harry.


Heidi I did enjoy the series, but only after the 3rd book was I hooked. I was amused and delighted by your review. I was much reminded of Dan Savages - Savage Love column where Dan had said that men think about sex all the time and they want to have sex with other women . And everyone responded that men don’t think that, and he’s ridiculous and crazy and their men aren’t like that. In fact here is his column if you’re interested http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Sa... . Needless to say, everyone who responded was a woman. And a few columns later men replied (here’s the link if you are interested http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Sa... ) and the jest of it was of course we (men) do but can practice self control.


Richard I've just started reading this book, and now I'm kind of hoping I will really hate it just so I can write a totally unpolitic, sarcastic review too! As Heather and Tatiana said, I am quite gobsmacked about the utter moronicity of some of the fanboys. And fangirls - in order not to be sexist, heaven forfend!
It's a book. Some people will like it. Others will not - I'm quite enjoying it, but I'm only 50 pages in...
So I can't really say anything about the book itself, but i can say, your review was excellent, Penny. If the monkeys throw their crap at you, laugh gently and walk away ;-)

Oh yeah, and some of us males think about other things besides sex. Sometimes I think of engines, and occasionally when I'm feeling outdoorsy, chopping wood - or doesn't that count?


message 39: by Sem (new) - rated it 3 stars

Sem Wow I feel for your husband, with a wife like you I'd have a vacant look on my face too.


message 40: by Kristen (new) - added it

Kristen Did you take out the offensive bits? I was expecting something juicy! You were completely rationale and quite funny... Do they not want us to know they think about sex all the time? Was it supposed to be a secret? Because, fellas... worst kept secret... ever.


Penny This is the original review, for which I've been attacked several times. Why? Because I made "sexist" statements. Unfortunately all the haters failed to gather that this review was to be taken in jest. Furthermore it's ironic because this series is so freaking sexist it's ridiculous. But I guess that's all cool with the dudes (and a few ladies) so long as it's just sexism against women.


message 42: by Penny (last edited Aug 16, 2012 07:35PM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Penny Sem wrote: "Wow I feel for your husband, with a wife like you I'd have a vacant look on my face too."

Seriously dude? Whatever. At least I took the time to write a freaking review. You just troll around on Goodreads apparently.

P.S. Were I your spouse I'd be hoping you'd stop harassing random people on the internet, get up, and do something worthwhile with your life. Also, I'd probably be throwing your shitty Jim Butcher books in the trash, where they belong.


message 43: by Kristen (new) - added it

Kristen "...with a wife like you I'd have a vacant look on my face too."

This isn't a proper argument at all. How can you infer the way she talks with her husband from her posts here? I think she probably likes her husband more than the random trolls taking her review way too seriously, and being condescending, insulting ass-hats in the bargain.

(Penny, I hope your husband isn't a condescending, insulting ass-hat with a hard-on for Harry Dresden, because you may be in trouble.)

"Furthermore it's ironic because this series is so freaking sexist it's ridiculous. But I guess that's all cool with the dudes (and a few ladies) so long as it's just sexism against women."

Actually, that's just sad. Now, I understand what someone said above, that if you're against sexism towards women, you shouldn't come out with sexist comments about men. Get it, I do. But if an entire genre of books is known for the way it describes women (this is from one of the peeps above who were so up in arms about your review), then I think you have every right to throw in some 'you men, all you think about is sex, how silly' and not be curb stomped for it. Entire genre. One review. Seriously, people.

And, besides, its not like what you said was actually sexist. From what I understood, you were saying men /must/ think about sex as often as the stereotype says, /if/ the way Butcher writes Harry Dresden is anything to go by. Yes, you did it in an anecdote style, which must have confused some of the people, but it was a criticism of the book's style, no? I frequently call the women protagonists in uf books dumb hoes with stripper names. That does not mean I think women are dumb hoes. I actually think I am pretty smart, for a hoe, but it does mean that I don't like the way the authors typically stylize their characters.


message 44: by Max (new)

Max Quin Wow there's so much drama here.


André Villar I've not read all the comments so, sorry if I repeat someone's point

I would say that sex, or viewing woman as someone to impress to protect, a potential mate IS a primary motivation for men.
Not the only one, not the most important at times but ever present.

That said wonderful revivew, even if I disagree.


Alisi ☆ needs to stop starting new books ☆ I'm not finished with this book but I sort of agree with you. I don't see it as sexism towards women but the way he wrote Murphy is completely sexist. It was like he had no idea what women feel or think so he took the most abstract route of trying "not to be sexist". Bleh


Teresa B. umm .. not a review just info on your personal life.. do a blog instead


Szymon Also, I was surprised that Dresden and Susan actually became a couple. Their relationship seemed so shallow, of mutual convenience, I didn't really see it becoming anything. I'm shocked he's suddenly in love with her
------------------------------
I mean it's about year between Fool Moon and Grave Peril. There was time for some growing up. Maybe the new graphic novel Ghoul Goblin will explain something because it's between those two.


Anthony  Corbo I appreciate all members who take the time to write reviews. This including you. Let me let you in on a secret if ya don't quite understand what motivates most men on why they do the things they do.....Fear. Fear of how the opposite gender will react in any and all situations. :•)


Ladyhawk Great review. I even agree with you. But I think 2 stars is too harsh. Go at least 3...?


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