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King Hereafter

4.29 of 5 stars 4.29 · rating details · 748 ratings · 123 reviews

Back in print by popular demand--"A stunning revelation of the historical Macbeth, harsh and brutal and eloquent." --Washington Post Book World.

With the same meticulous scholarship and narrative legerdemain she brought to her hugely popular Lymond Chronicles, our foremost historical novelist travels further into the past.In King Hereafter, Dorothy Dunnett's stage is the wi...more

Paperback, 736 pages

Published September 29th 1998 by Vintage (first published 1982)

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Dec 22, 2012 Jean Gobel rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: dunnett

I had never read Shakespeare's Macbeth, and really didn't know the story, in fact I thought he was a fictitious character, so this was new territory for me. The book starts with so many Viking names and places I felt lost after a chapter or two. But, I persevered, and must say it was a very satisfying book. Dorothy Dunnett at her best.

Reared from the age of 5 by a foster-father in the Orkneys, Thorfinn, the Earl of Orkney lives the hard but adventurous life in the north of early Scotland, surro...more

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Apr 02, 2011 Sandra aka Sleo rated it 5 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: ebook, historical, favorites

Nope - 5 stars. The longer I sit with it, the better it gets.

I started reading this book with a Dunnett group on Yahoo, but shortly got frustrated because it went so slow and there was virtually no discussion as many (including me) were first time readers and they're Nazis about spoilers. Personally, I don't mind spoilers and sometimes even seek them out. 'Spoilers' implies that all there is to a book is the plot and what happens, and if I know that then the whole book is spoiled. Since this is...more Nope - 5 stars. The longer I sit with it, the better it gets.

I started reading this book with a Dunnett group on Yahoo, but shortly got frustrated because it went so slow and there was virtually no discussion as many (including me) were first time readers and they're Nazis about spoilers. Personally, I don't mind spoilers and sometimes even seek them out. 'Spoilers' implies that all there is to a book is the plot and what happens, and if I know that then the whole book is spoiled. Since this is the story of the life of a king of Alba, as Scotland was called at that time, it's hardly a spoiler to know that he dies in the end. It doesn't take the sadness away. At least not for me. To say that is to say that I don't want to know about the life of the people I love because I know they are going to die in the end. What poppycock. And after a month and a half, I got impatient and just read to the end.

For me, a lot of the enjoyment of a book is in the reading, the way it's written, the characters, the setting, the twists and turns along the way. And this one, being a Dunnett book, has plenty of wealth in all of those story elements.

I never read or studied Shakespeare beyond what I had to in high school, so wasn't familiar with the plot of Macbeth, the Shakespearean play. I just read a summary on Wikipedia and this story is nothing like that. The fictional king, Thorfinn (his Viking name) who later is called Macbeth (his baptismal name) is loosely based on a real king of Scotland who ruled Scotland, then called Alba, from 1040 to 1057. Dunnett's story is a more accurate portrayal of what we know of his life than the famous play, at least according to the Wikipedia article on him. Wikipedia on Macbeth, King of Scotland.

No one matches Dunnett in creating characters. Thorfinn, a tall, gangly, ugly, black haired Viking becomes a hero along the way. Typical Dunnett style, we only see him at first through the eyes of others who may or may not know what is really going on in Thorfinn's head. It becomes clear fairly rapidly that he is a great fighter and smart ... very smart. He's also an independent thinker and this is totally frustrating to his foster father, Thorkel Fostri, a peripheral character who is funny, fierce, loyal and finally lovable. One can only imagine his sorrow after Thorfinn is killed. Thorfinn's wife, Groa, is also a memorable character and is left to finish his work at his death. The love between them is vividly and poignantly written.

The only thing that originally mades me lower my rating from 5 stars is that there is a lot of time spent talking about the people, the family lines, the political machinations, and so forth. I got lost as I could not follow who was related to who and why unless they were main characters. And since we follow Thorfinn/Macbeth's life from around the time he was 5 until his death in his 40's, there are a LOT of people. Fortunately I'm pretty good at picking out the significant people along the way, so was able to keep track of most of what was going on. But after sitting with it for a month, my feelings about the story just keep getting better.

Well worth reading, if a significant investment in time. I read the ebook which was 902 pages.(less)

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Jan 01, 2013 Kathy rated it 5 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: historical-fiction

I don't give too many book 5 stars, but this one deserves every one of them. I first read King Hereafter years ago, when it was originally published. Recently, when adventures in genealogy got me interested in this era, I remember this book and got my hands on a new copy (as I'd gotten rid of my original all those years ago).

This is historical fiction at its best. The story and characters are great, and the research behind it is flawless. Too many times these days, publishers pass off poorly wri...more

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Nov 21, 2009 Jennifer rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: historical, literature, favorites

This is perhaps my favorite book of all time. First, the historical detail is incredible (although there are some who fault her for fusing two real leaders). In addition, the plot is tightly woven so that any loose strings are eventually gathered in the end, which is important to me. I hate it when authors bring in people or events and then never refer to them again.
I especially love her characterization. Thorfinn/Macbeth has his flaws, and we always see how thoughtful he is about the decisio...more

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Feb 17, 2010 Mike rated it 5 of 5 stars

‘King Hereafter’ by Dorothy Dunnett
Who was the real Macbeth, and did he visit Chester in England?
According to the research by historical novelist Dorothy Dunnett, he was the 11th Century Thorfinn Sigurdason, Earl of Caithness & Orkney and lived in the times of King Canute, Earl Leofric of Mercia and his wife Lady Godiva.
His father was disputed, so he was named after his mother Beatha, hence the name Macbeth. His enemy was Rognvald.
This fascinating story (published by Arrow Books) is love s...more

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Sep 11, 2012 Katherine rated it 5 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: historical-fiction, 2012, own

This is a tough book to rate, it is in turns so dense as to be almost incomprehensible (unless you're a historian) and then utterly brilliant. There were long stretches that I almost abandoned the book and then times when I couldn't put it down and read long into the night. So while I have to say the writing is more than a bit uneven in my opinion, it's still Dunnett--and you close the book knowing that you missed many of the subtleties and nuances on a first reading.

At first I thought to give...more

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Apr 19, 2012 Smcleish rated it 3 of 5 stars

Shelves: owned

Originally published on my blog here in March 1999.

Dorothy Dunnett's novel of Scotland in the Dark Ages concerns the historical Macbeth - or does it? She certainly knows more about the situation in eleventh century Scotland than Shakespeare did (Macbeth ruled just before the Norman conquest of England), but her plot relies on an identification between two historical characters. Macbeth, she assumes, was in fact the baptismal name of the Viking Earl of Orkney, Thorfinn II.In some ways, this works...more Originally published on my blog here in March 1999.

Dorothy Dunnett's novel of Scotland in the Dark Ages concerns the historical Macbeth - or does it? She certainly knows more about the situation in eleventh century Scotland than Shakespeare did (Macbeth ruled just before the Norman conquest of England), but her plot relies on an identification between two historical characters. Macbeth, she assumes, was in fact the baptismal name of the Viking Earl of Orkney, Thorfinn II.In some ways, this works quite well: Macbeth is a likely candidate for a Gaelic baptismal name (it means "son of life"), though a saint's name might have been more likely; Thorfinn was descended from the kings of Scots and would have had at least as good a claim to the throne as the line which eventually established itself (both related to earlier kings through descent from daughters of Malcolm II); the interest in Orkney makes him plausibly involved in an attempt to unify Scotland, which provides an interesting political aspect to the novel; his Viking background paves the way for a clash of cultures, also of interest to the reader.

There are, however, arguments against the identification of Thorfinn and Macbeth, and the subsidiary identification of Ingeborg, Thorfinn's Norwegian wife, with Gruoch, more commonly known as Lady Macbeth (which is also done with the baptismal name device). The way the Scottish kingship generally worked at this time was that the succession alternated between groups of cousins, patrilineal descendants of Kenneth MacAlpine, who had originally united the kingdom. This system meant that minorities, the perilous rule of underage kings, was avoided, at the cost of making murder by a cousin the most likely way for a Scots king to die. Macbeth was one of the last kings to gain the throne in this manner; Malcolm III, who killed Macbeth, basically managed to stabilise the succession in his own descendants (barring short usurpations by Lulach - a relation of Gruoch's - and Donald I - Malcolm's brother). This was partly achieved because Malcolm held onto the throne for a considerable period, during which he killed most of the other potential candidates for the throne.

Now, both Macbeth and Gruoch are provided by the Scots chroniclers with lineages connecting them with the Scottish crown, which do not match with those existing for Thorfinn and Ingeborg. While it is clear that such lineages would be invented by usurpers to give them a claim to the throne (there are several instances of this in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle, for example), the way that Dunnett has set things out in her book makes Thorfinn's main claim to the throne his mother's descent, while the chronicles imply that Macbeth's is his father's, whether real or spurious.

Another objection to this identification is that Macbeth is known to have died in 1057, while Thorfinn is thought to have lived rather longer, until about 1065 (though the exact date of his death is not known). I don't know what the evidence is for assuming the later date, but it is that given by Tapsell's Monarchs in the table listing the Earls of Orkney.

The methodology of an academic historian would require that an assumption such as the identification of the two men is not made without supporting evidence. The less you assume, the less you can get wrong. As a historical novelist, you can make any assumption you like which can help your story, so long as it is reasonably plausible. The assumption Dunnett makes here drives an interesting novel, though a very long one - Macbeth reigned for seventeen years after all, not the few months that is the impression left by Shakespeare.

Less acceptable is the way that Dunnett attempts to force Thorfinn/Macbeth into the mould of the heroes of her historical series, Lymond and Niccolo (both of whom are fictional characters). Thorfinn is made to have almost exactly the same characteristics as these heroes. The character may be fascinating, and equally something of a superhero, but the three men should certainly be different from each other.(less)

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Dec 07, 2011 Anne rated it 5 of 5 stars

I actually read all Dorothy Dunnett's historical fiction this fall, rereading in the case of the Lymond series, but this is the only stand alone book. It's definitely my sort of thing. There's a part where it dissolves into a thousand similar names and places, and when the going gets tough, the characters get cryptic, but I just read on until the story revealed what was bothering them.

The Lymond books put romantic adventurous characters in a wonderful and vivid historical background, but in the...more

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Aug 25, 2011 Bruce rated it 5 of 5 stars

This is a monumental historical novel about Thorfinn, Earl of Orkney, who Dunnett, after much research, became convinced was identical to the Macbeth of Shakespeare’s play (most historians apparently believe that these two contemporaneous early 11th century rulers were cousins). Dunnett’s work is the story of Thorfinn’s progress from a ruler of part of the Orkney Islands, just north of Scotland, to a position of king of all Scotland (Alba), and how he then lost the kingship.

The story itself is...more This is a monumental historical novel about Thorfinn, Earl of Orkney, who Dunnett, after much research, became convinced was identical to the Macbeth of Shakespeare’s play (most historians apparently believe that these two contemporaneous early 11th century rulers were cousins). Dunnett’s work is the story of Thorfinn’s progress from a ruler of part of the Orkney Islands, just north of Scotland, to a position of king of all Scotland (Alba), and how he then lost the kingship.

The story itself is fascinating and, to some extent, factually accurate. It involves relationships among multiple rulers of small kingdoms throughout Scotland, England, Ireland, Wales, and the ever-present Scandinavian countries of Denmark and Norway. Orkney itself was primarily Scandinavian, settled and ruled by Viking descendents. Much of Scotland was Celtic, part of the Celtic fringe forced north after the arrival in southern and eastern England of the Romans and then the Anglo-Saxons. This particular novel focuses on the years just before the Norman Conquest of 1966, but Normans were already present in the British Isles, and their influence was not negligible. Added to this mix was the mélange of religious orientations – Scandinavian pagans, Christians of Celtic orientation moving into Britain from Ireland, Christians more loyal to Rome – and the continual clerical maneuvering that both supported and undermined political leaders. The cast of characters is enormous, and the several included genealogical charts are very helpful, as are the excellent maps. Some prior knowledge of the history of this area and period makes understanding the story much easier, but it is not essential.

The main characters are Thorfinn himself, a deeply sympathetic figure – tall, deep-voiced, of commanding presence (though “ugly”), brave, skillful, wise, and compassionate, and his beloved wife, the lovely and wise Groa. A small circle of close friends and supporters also plays a continuous role, and these individuals – Thorfinn’s foster-father Thorkel, and Thorfinn’s closest friend, the cleric Sulien, among others - are clearly delineated. (At least one scholar has suggested that Shakespeare’s portrayal of a villainous Macbeth was the result of Shakespeare’s attempt to obtain the favor of the reigning monarchs of his own day, monarchs that were the descendents of Macbeth’s enemy, the Earl of Siward.)

This is not an easy or light book to read, its more than 700 pages of small font containing an exceedingly complex narrative. The reader is advised to allocate adequate time and demonstrate significant patience as he or she moves through a narrative that is rich and subtle, fascinating and gripping, rich and deep in human drama and pathos. Such an approach pays rich dividends, providing both a moving reading experience and vivid and haunting memories of the period and its events. This is one of the best historical novels I have read and one of the most satisfying.
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Feb 16, 2011 Mike Hampson rated it 4 of 5 stars

Shelves: historical-fiction

Even though I got an off-taste from the little bit of Dunnett I've read (which is only a matter of pages), Macbeth is my favorite of Shakespeare's plays, so I thought I'd give this one a chance. The story is really built around the idea that the actual Scottish king Macbeth and a half-Viking Earl of Orkney named Thorfinn were the same person; there's no real connection to the play, except for depictions of a few events that become part of the myth around Macbeth which inspired Shakespeare, like...more Even though I got an off-taste from the little bit of Dunnett I've read (which is only a matter of pages), Macbeth is my favorite of Shakespeare's plays, so I thought I'd give this one a chance. The story is really built around the idea that the actual Scottish king Macbeth and a half-Viking Earl of Orkney named Thorfinn were the same person; there's no real connection to the play, except for depictions of a few events that become part of the myth around Macbeth which inspired Shakespeare, like the Birnam Woods coming to Dunsinane Hill.

There's an attitude of "my characters are so cool" particularly in the beginning, which is what I didn't like about the tiny bits of the Lymond books I've read, and there are too many moments where the outcome of a situation feels like the result of Thorfinn's awesomeness instead of his effort. Her choice to mirror Shakespeare's use of prophecy, albeit with a completely different context and effect, makes the problem worse: Thorfinn knows and is resigned to his destiny, but when your main character doesn't feel like an active participant in his fate, why should you expect your readers to?

Dunnett's portrayal of the culture and the events of the time more than make up for all this, but I never got past the feeling that I was reading about imaginary people in a real setting. I realize that's basically the point of a work of historical fiction, but I mean that I was reading with two different and incompatible degrees of suspended disbelief. I did like King Hereafter and I'm more likely to read her other historical fiction now, but it wasn't until the last quarter of the book that I was even remotely emotionally invested in any of the characters.

I'm being more critical of Dunnett than I would be of many authors, because she's held up as one of the greatest writers of historical fiction. She's recreated her historical setting here very thoroughly and believably, and on the strength of that alone I can understand the merits of her reputation. She does not seem as strong at integrating her characters so that they're a believable product of that setting, however. I don't have any sense of her ability to create a story, given that she's working to support her idea of Macbeth==Thorfinn and reconcile the events attached to those names, but she definitely does a very solid job of that.(less)

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Dec 26, 2010 Sydney rated it 4 of 5 stars

I am extremely glad I read this book but it was a very strange experience. It's a historical novel about the real MacBeth (who I will now forever ever more only be able to think of as Thorfinn) and his astounding wife Groa. Yes, you heard me correctly: astounding. Dunnett clearly wanted to redeem these characters from their brilliant, legendary but nefarious Shakespearean heritage and show how Thorfinn did his utmost to open medieval Alba (a.k.a. Scotland) to the then-modern world. By the third...more I am extremely glad I read this book but it was a very strange experience. It's a historical novel about the real MacBeth (who I will now forever ever more only be able to think of as Thorfinn) and his astounding wife Groa. Yes, you heard me correctly: astounding. Dunnett clearly wanted to redeem these characters from their brilliant, legendary but nefarious Shakespearean heritage and show how Thorfinn did his utmost to open medieval Alba (a.k.a. Scotland) to the then-modern world. By the third page, I was utterly captivated when the narrator, after giving a rough if poetic outline of the general political situation between Orkney and Norway and what was supposed to be Thorfinn's peace-making role as the next Earl of Orkney, then says, "That was the plan, until the brat wrecked it." Thorfinn's political astuteness and subtlety have their complement in Groa, even if it takes him several hundred pages and a life-threatening wound to figure this out. By the end, I was heartbroken at their fate and Alba's.

However.
It's 721 pages long at font size 8.
And for the first 200-300 pages I was utterly lost amidst all the politics and astuteness and subtlety. By the end I was only slightly less lost. Dunnett never shows off or comes across as arrogant in her impressive research into and knowledge of all the Byzantine connections and negotiations going on at this time between Alba, Orkney, Ireland, England, Norway, Denmark, Germany, Normandy, and Rome, but I think it would only be clear if the reader already has a well-grounded sense of medieval English history. I kept feeling like I was supposed to know what it meant that, for example, one character in any given highly charged political scene raised his eyebrow at certain words. Everyone else seemed to know whether war was actually just declared or completely averted. Maybe it was to give the reader a sense of just how perceptive and far ahead of everyone Thorfinn and Groa could be, but it drove me at various moments to almost put this on my "couldn't finish" list. I never did though because despite this frustration, their tension and humor and drive were too compelling. Thorfinn's gruffness and dry humor become two of his greatest strengths as one gets to know him.
I just wish Dunnett could have kept up the narrative balance that made ch 1 so compelling. As I said though, these characters were so intriguing I couldn't put the book away, even when I had a hard time liking any of them in the first two hundred pages. By the end I had the utmost admiration and affection for them both (and several others as well) and if you're in the mood to learn about medieval Scotland and willing to relinquish an exact understanding of the political twists and turns (at least for a first read), then I can highly recommend this book. (less)

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Feb 26, 2010 Margaret rated it 4 of 5 stars

Shelves: historical-fiction, authors-cd

King Hereafter is a towering, beautifully written historical epic about Thorfinn, Earl of Orkney, whom Dunnett identifies also as Macbeth, the king of Scotland made famous by Shakespeare's play. (This identification is not widely accepted by historians, I should note, though Dunnett certainly paints a picture that works well within the confines of her story.) The politics are sufficiently intricate that I was very glad to have a working knowledge of at least the English politics of the period (j...more

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Jun 23, 2009 Janet rated it 4 of 5 stars Recommends it for: historical fictioin

If you want to either feel really culturally literate or realize that you have major gaps in your historical knowledge, just read Dorothy Dunnett. Personally, I love her books--if you can plow your way through historical and literary references, not to mention long quotations in French, she creates amazing characters to love and admire or hate and detest. The first set I read were the Lymond Chronicles, set in Scotland (and roaming all over the world from there) with titles all based on chess re...more If you want to either feel really culturally literate or realize that you have major gaps in your historical knowledge, just read Dorothy Dunnett. Personally, I love her books--if you can plow your way through historical and literary references, not to mention long quotations in French, she creates amazing characters to love and admire or hate and detest. The first set I read were the Lymond Chronicles, set in Scotland (and roaming all over the world from there) with titles all based on chess references, this is a tale of a brilliant person, linguist, military leader and charismatic young man you will never forget. I haven't cried so much in years (always a sign of a good book for me).
Next I went through all the Niccolo Rising books--a prequel by several generations to the Lymond Chronicles. I was a little disappointed that the genealogies of these two books never quite matched up--I kept waiting for characters from Lymond to appear as youngsters in the Niccolo books, but they never did--it seemed there were a couple of generations missing. Still, excellent reading and wonderful characters.
So, when I came across Dunnett's re-telling of the Macbeth story in the book store, I couldn't resist. Almost as soon as I got started reading, I had to go dig up a copy of Shakespeare's "Macbeth" and read it again, just to refresh my memory. But don't expect there to be too many similarities between the two. For one thing, you will love and admire Dunnett's Macbeth in a way you couldn't Shakespeare's. We see Thorfinn/Macbeth over his lifetime and get to know him much more intimately than we possibly could the character in the short play. Once again, Dunnett overwhelms with her historical references--the research that goes in to her books is remarkable, but way, way too much for me. Eventually, I learn to read past a lot of material to the character scenes--she really brings to life some very endearing people. It is worth all that other stuff to get at the real nuggets of Dorothy Dunnett's beautiful and expansive writing.

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May 07, 2011 Carolyn rated it 5 of 5 stars

King Hereafter

This book qualifies as Advanced Reading. Although each sentence is a work of art, and the construction of the novel is masterful, it’s not a tale you just gallop through. Rather, it must be read like some poetry, by immersing yourself into the words and images and allowing them to create an experience that engages your mind on more than one level. For 720 densely packed pages in the oversize paperback edition.

There’s also an enormous cast of characters who move all over northern an...more

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Jul 30, 2011 Meg Morley rated it 4 of 5 stars

This book took me much longer to read than normal; I usually read about a book per week. It doesn't have anything to do with how long this particular book is, it's just very difficult to get into and keep up with. Dunnett's writing is a little overly-subtle for my taste - I'm all for letting your readers figure things out on their own, but some things do need to be explained. Most things become much clearer, though, if you can make it through the first half, and I think a second reading would he...more

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Nov 13, 2012 Nicole rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: favourites

I just finished reading this for the first time, and I'm still recovering. I'm in a lot of wonderful Dunnett-style pain at the moment.

I've read Dunnett before, having devoured The Lymond Chronicles around this time last year, so I had an idea of what to expect. I knew to prepare myself to feeling confused and in over my head, and to brace myself for meticulous historical detail that I no doubt would struggle to follow. And I'm glad I did because a lot of the importance of the history was lost on...more

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Dec 20, 2010 Polly rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: fiction, historical

Terrific book. Not an easy book, partly because you can't help liking Macbeth, but you know perfectly well it's not going to end happily, but also because, as with any of the revisionist Richard III stuff, you can't help feeling what I rotten deal that someone who was obviously a better king than anyone else at the time got the reputation of being a louse, in Macbeth's case, almost entirely due to the efforts of William Shakespeare. In Shakespeare's defense, it turns out that one of the people o...more

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Aug 01, 2012 Sandi rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: most-read, historical-fiction

A brilliant book. Hard to get into at first, even with being familiar with Dorothy's elliptical style, partly due to the unfamiliar 11C period. But well-worth the effort. My choice as my Desert Island Book (as I could not choose another Dunnett book without wanting the rest of the series as well).

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Feb 17, 2010 Barbara rated it 5 of 5 stars

I started reading this 11c. historical fiction of MacBeth out of desperation as I couldn't get the next in the Lymond Series. And got completely into this time travel sense of feeling, knowing the time/places for the story. Thorfinn, with a conplex lineage, as all of the leaders in this epic have, is brilliant, unattractive, and fearless. Even when I can't pronounce most of those Saxon, Norse, and even Celtic names from this time, I just love seeing them ~ all those consonants! And the love and...more

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Sep 07, 2009 Michele Weiner rated it 5 of 5 stars

I adore Dorothy Dunnett. You have to have your thinking cap on when you read any of her books, and she knows her subject and her time period inside and out. She has a super imagination, and she foreshadows a whole lot, which makes you feel you've missed something when you probably haven't missed it quite yet. Her foreshadowings are more like a clue that you have to remember this part so you'll be able to connect it up later. Her plots are very complex, and her language is almost Shakespearean fo...more

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Oct 30, 2009 Starling rated it 3 of 5 stars

Shelves: fiction, historical

This book was written in 1981. Dorothy Dunnett was a favorite author, and I reread this book and her Lymond Chronicles many times, but for some reason never read either of her other two series. I never owned copies of these books because they were easy to find at any library, until, of course they wore out and were discarded. At that point all of the author's books were out of print. I went on to other authors and other books.

I located an inexpensive used copy of the book through Amazon. And I h...more

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Sep 18, 2007 Sallie rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: historicalfiction

A long but fascinating story about Macbeth which still lingers in my mind at the oddest moments. Haunting story.

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Jul 28, 2011 Erin rated it 5 of 5 stars

Best book I ever read. In fact, I read it 10 times. I read it the first time so quickly that I actually went back to page one when I finished it and read it straight through. And then did it again. The third time, with a dictionary in my hand. The human depth in this complex historical novel is so intense it left me weeping at the end. I feel I know these people. I mourn for them and I celebrate with them. Dorothy Dunnett is simply an extraordinary writer. I've read a dozen of her other books, e...more

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Jun 07, 2010 Ramon Sunico rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: classic-favorite, historical-fiction

Dunnett takes the raw matter of her research on the historical Macbeth and turns it into an engrossing work of historical "speculative fiction". By the end of the novel, what we have is much more than addenda to
Shakespeare's great dramatic discourse on ambition. What we have is an appreciation of how the lands of the Eddas and Vikings opened up to the power and symbology of Rome, how the great culture of the North in-formed the the subsequent history of Britain, and how great leaders are the tr...more

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Oct 10, 2012 Kasia James rated it 2 of 5 stars

Shelves: general-fiction

I confess that I found reading this book something of an act of endurance. It supposedly tells the story of the 'real' Macbeth, who apparently was not a deeply flawed ruthless murderer, but in fact a king who did his best to unite a fractured Scotland into one nation.
There were two issues that I struggled with in the book. Firstly, this is described as a novel, so now I'm not really sure how much is documented history (some of it, presumably), and how much is an invention of Ms. Dunnetts. I've r...more

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Jun 17, 2012 Sarah rated it 5 of 5 stars

I have now read this book 3+ times, and I agree with Dorothy Dunnett that this is her master work. It is a difficult book to tackle. Like most of Dunnett's characters, you don't learn much directly about what her main characters are thinking. After an incredible amount of research, Dunnett became convinced that Thorfinn, Earl of Orkney and Caithness (a documented, real person), and MacBeth, King of Alba (another documented, real person), were, in fact, the same person. This book is about how Tho...more

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Aug 25, 2012 Peter rated it 4 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: historical-fiction

If you are used to Dunnett's Lymond Chronicles or the House of Nicolo, this book will have a familiar voice but in many ways a different style. Told from many viewpoints, it concentrates on the life of a historical figure - Macbeth - about whom much has been written but little is known. So Dunnett chooses a particular likely (?) story to tell, of a complex and able man who changed the world around him. Nonetheless, she has much less freedom than in her other series and thus the story sometimes t...more

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Oct 26, 2011 Betsy rated it 2 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Recommended to Betsy by: Jinny

Shelves: fiction, historical

This review has been hidden because it contains spoilers. To view it, click here. Wow. So, that took a long time to finish. (Which is probably a big hint towards my feelings about "King Hereafter".) I waffled on my star-rating, because in the end this isn't a book I'd read again and I'll be careful with my recommendations. But at the same time, it's Dorothy Dunnett!! I love her! I've read both of her ginormous series and enjoyed them tons and tons and it's not like her writing took a sudden dive in this particular book.

It breaks down like this: On the plus side we have Dunnet...more Wow. So, that took a long time to finish. (Which is probably a big hint towards my feelings about "King Hereafter".) I waffled on my star-rating, because in the end this isn't a book I'd read again and I'll be careful with my recommendations. But at the same time, it's Dorothy Dunnett!! I love her! I've read both of her ginormous series and enjoyed them tons and tons and it's not like her writing took a sudden dive in this particular book.

It breaks down like this: On the plus side we have Dunnett's firm grasp of the historical period and the ability to translate it so completely I felt like I could not only smell the sea-salt air but also grasp why going Viking (ie: lots of pillaging) made for a good time. I greatly admire Dunnett's ability to make me, with my modern sensibilities, understand the mindset of people from a very different time-period. There was also Dunnett's familiar (and much loved by me) genius-Chess-player protagonist. So I started out a happy little reader. Then the negatives started.

A large weight on the negative-side is that this is an actual historical figure she's writing about. And he's a king. Not being a behind-the-scenes guy, our protag has to know everything that's occurring on the world-stage he's playing on. So the narrative would screech to a halt so we could get a breakdown of what all the various power-players in all the various countries were up to at that particular place in time. Which made it very easy for me to put the book down and not very eager to pick it back up again.

But I could have hand-waved that as a necessary evil in a shorter story (relatively, if you consider her two series) covering a long time period. What got me worried about midway through (and the end unfortunately bore it out), was the lack of a powerful antagonist. Dunnett's two series both pitted her incredibly gifted protagonists against equally powerful opponents and that's what kept the stories compelling. But in this case, no one really challenges our hero. Well, other than, you know, life. But that doesn't really make for killer epics. And, I would argue, doesn't work if you've set up a heroic protagonist like Dunnett does in this book.

This is where I totally spoil the ending. STOP NOW TO AVOID SPOILERS!!!

In the end, we had this genius character trying to carve out a niche of civilization in a hostile and volatile world and he's supported by this vast cast of characters (too vast, actually -- I couldn't keep track of most of them and so the various friendships felt kind of pasted on, even when the text was telling me that no seriously this is an incredibly deep friendship) and I watch him swat at flies, swat at flies, swat at flies and then... nothing. He dies. It ends. I think there were hints that our hero's work wasn't totally in vain, but the hints were small enough and the work I'd put into finishing the damn book was hard enough that I felt disgruntled.

So, I didn't like it but could see how others might. Now I have to figure out what to read next. *sigh* Probably be best to reread something I know for sure I'll enjoy.(less)

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Dec 31, 2010 Teresa rated it 5 of 5 stars

Shelves: owned

King Hereafter is the story of Macbeth, king of Alba. That’s right, Macbeth of the three witches, Birnam Wood, and “Is this a dagger I see before me?” Except that Dunnett’s version of this man has very little in common with Shakespeare’s ambitious murderer.

Dunnett’s version of this 11th-century king is actually the same man as Thorfinn, the Earl of Orkney. I know next to nothing about the history of this period, but I understand that she arrived at this conclusion after doing extensive research...more King Hereafter is the story of Macbeth, king of Alba. That’s right, Macbeth of the three witches, Birnam Wood, and “Is this a dagger I see before me?” Except that Dunnett’s version of this man has very little in common with Shakespeare’s ambitious murderer.

Dunnett’s version of this 11th-century king is actually the same man as Thorfinn, the Earl of Orkney. I know next to nothing about the history of this period, but I understand that she arrived at this conclusion after doing extensive research into the period. I can’t speak to the likelihood of her being correct, but I can tell you that her version of the man is an exciting figure whose story took my breath away when I first delved into it years ago.

Even better is Dunnett’s version of Lady Macbeth, Groa, a Norwegian beauty previously wed to one of Macbeth’s political rivals, Gillacomghain of Moray. Thorfinn initially takes Groa as a war prize after he defeats Gillacomghain, but she soon becomes a full partner of his mind and his heart. The scenes between the two of them are the heart and soul of the novel. Although I love this relationship, and it’s the thing that stands out most clearly from my first reading of the book, I don’t want to give the idea that this is a historical romance. Far from it. Political machinations, battle plans, and religious transformations also get ample page time.

As much as I love this book, I must warn potential readers that it can be hard going. In fact, on this second read I found myself wondering several times in the early chapters why I loved it so much on the first read. Aside from a rip-roaring footrace along the oars of a longboat, I didn’t find much to excite me in the first 200 pages, and at times I felt utterly lost. Dunnett just throws readers into this entirely new and alien world of 11th-century Scotland without much in the way of help. I have learned with Dunnett that sometimes the best thing to do is to figure out who the central figures are and just worry about them.

So with this in mind, I read on, and at about page 200, it clicked. I remembered what I loved so much, and I started to see patterns that I hadn’t noticed on the first read, when the close relationships were my main interest. Not every section is equally interesting, and there are plenty of things I still don’t quite get, but I think that’s a testimony to the richness of Dunnett’s narrative, rather than to any muddiness in the storytelling. Even having read it before, I found myself having to put the book down several times, not because I was frustrated or confused but because I was overcome with emotion at the turns that Thorfinn’s life took.

See my complete review at Shelf Love.(less)

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May 12, 2009 Kristi Thompson rated it 3 of 5 stars

This review has been hidden because it contains spoilers. To view it, click here.

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About Dorothy Dunnett

Dorothy Dunnett OBE was a Scottish historical novelist. She is best known for her six-part series about Francis Crawford of Lymond, The Lymond Chronicles, which she followed with the eight-part prequel The House of Niccolò. She also wrote a novel about the real Macbeth called King Hereafter (1982), and a series of mystery novels centred around Johnson Johnson, a portrait painter/spy.

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Books by Dorothy Dunnett

The Game of Kings (The Lymond Chronicles, #1)

Queens' Play (The Lymond Chronicles, #2)

The Disorderly Knights (The Lymond Chronicles, #3)

Pawn in Frankincense (The Lymond Chronicles, #4)

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Quotes from King Hereafter

“You have only to lift your hand,' Thorkel Fostri said. And after a moment, 'What else were you born for?'

'Why not happiness, like other men?" Thorfinn said.

'You have that,' said his foster-father. 'But if you try to trap it, it will change. Why do you resist? It is your right.'

'I resist because it is no use resisting,' Thorfinn said. 'Do you not think that is unfair? I shall be King because I was King; and I shall die because I did die; and did I remember them, I could even tell what are the three ways it might befall me.” — 3 people liked it

“A man of over thirty might be held to be at the height of his powers, but not necessarily of his wisdom.” — 2 people liked it

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