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In cosa crede chi non crede?

3.67  ·  Rating Details ·  826 Ratings  ·  54 Reviews
Carteggio tra Carlo Maria Martini, ex arcivescovo di Milano e Umberto Eco: contiene delle perle autentiche, riferibili soprattutto a temi di grande profondità trattati con l’acume, la cultura, la franchezza di due autentici giganti del pensiero dei nostri mala tempora.

Con interventi di
Emanuele Severino
Manlio Sgalambro
Eugenio Scalfari
Indro Montanelli
Vittorio Foa
Claudio Mart
...more
Paperback, Liberal sentieri, 143 pages
Published 1996 by Liberal Libri
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Somayeh
Feb 21, 2016 Somayeh rated it it was ok  ·  review of another edition
خواندنش خالی از لطف نیست، قرار است پرسش و پاسخی باشد میان امبرتو اکو و کاردینال مارتینی جهت یافتن مشترکات میان افراد مذهبی و غیر مذهبی، اما هر دو طرف بیشتر به کلی گویی راجع به موضوع مطرح شده میپردازند.

برای من بخش انتهایی کتاب که اکو در مورد اخلاق و ضمانت اجرایی آن نزد غیرمذهبیها مینویسد بسیار جالب و خواندنی بود.
Rebecca
In a time when academia and scholarly religion seems terribly at odds with the living Catholic faith, two men open a dialogue which is indeed a confrontation. They confront however, not each other, but the issues of apocalyptic perspective, abortion, women in the Church, violence and much more. These two men recognize these issues not as polemics to be tossed back and forth for endless bantering, but as fundamental to outlining a definition of "humanity." Both men are scholars and people of fait ...more
COME_TO_THE_DARK_SIDE
Es un diálogo epistolar entre Umberto Eco y el cardenal Carlo Maria Martini. Se puede leer de una sentada, es bastante corto y te incita a pensar sobre la ética de las acciones. Además, demuestra que discutir sobre religión puede ser entretenido. Trata de los temas que normalmente causan conflictos entre creyentes y no creyentes: el origen de la vida, el apocalipsis y la igualdad de género en las instituciones religiosas.
Pierre Menard
Nov 19, 2016 Pierre Menard rated it it was ok  ·  review of another edition
Recommends it for: Who got all the answers
Nel marzo 1995, sulla rivista liberal, Umberto Eco pubblicò una lettera aperta al cardinale Carlo Maria Martini, arcivescovo di Milano, per avviare un dialogo tra intellettuali in posizione di parità: un laico non credente (ma non necessariamente ateo militante) e un religioso credente (ma di vedute molto aperte, talvolta eterodosse). Lo scopo: discutere temi di grande importanza per la collettività, cercando di chiarire punti di contatto e di opposizione tra credenti e non credenti. Si parte da ...more
Subhanî Zengil
مەسەلەیەکی کوردی هەیە دەڵێت: کەر لەکێ تۆپییە، کوندە لەکێ دڕایە...
ناو و ناوەڕۆکی ئەم کتێبە ئاسمان و ڕێسمانە، بەڵام پێم وابێ خەتای دوو گەنگەشکارەکە نییە، بەڵکو دەکرێت ناونانەکە بیرۆکەی کارمەندێکی ئەو ڕۆژنامەیە بووبێت کە پارچە نووسینەکانی تێدا بڵاو کراونەتەوە. لەگەڵ ئەوەشدا، هەر شتێکی وای تێدا نەبوو کاریگەریێک بەسەر بیری ئینسانەوە جێ بهێڵێت.
ئەو ماوەیەی ئەم کتێبەم دەخوێندەوە جەوم باش تێکچووبوو، ئاخر هەر حەرفێکیم دەخوێندەوە وام دەزانی گێرەم پێ دەکەن.
جارجار شتێک دەیترساندم، بەخۆمم دەگوت: دەبێت ئەو کتێ
...more
Amir Azad
اصل موضوع کتاب و گشوده شدن باب این گفتوگو بسیار جالب است. دو سوی این گفتوگو هم چهرههای نامدار و درخشانی هستند. البته متن کتاب کوتاه و حاوی فقط ۳ پرسش و پاسخ است که ای کاش بیشتر بود. کتاب هرچه پیش میرود بهتر میشود به پرسش و پاسخ سوم به وضوح درخشانتر، کاربردی تر، و کارآمدتر است.

کتاب البته سختخوان، پر اصطلاح و ارجاع و اجمالا تخصصی است. اما خواندنی و یادگرفتنی است.

ای کاش این نامه نگاری بیشتر ادامه پیدا می کرد.
...more
Branche SJ
Nov 02, 2012 Branche SJ rated it it was amazing  ·  review of another edition
"The final topic of discussion is an overall belief in God. This time the roles have reversed and Martini questions Eco on the basic ethical foundation of a layman. He asks what a layman bases his moral behavior on, if not a belief in God. Eco informs him that there are forms of religiosity, even in the absence of faith. There are universal conceptions of constraint and believers with an ethical foundation still sin. One who doesn’t believe in God can still make sense of his own life. However, t ...more
B
Jan 19, 2013 B rated it it was ok  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: 2013
I fear that much of this book was over my head as I do not have the sort of religious background these men do and perhaps because of that my rating is not fair. However, due to the title "a confrontation" I expected this book to be an actual debate but instead the men focus on finding common ground, so basically they are holding each other's hand telling each other how great they are the entire book instead of actually putting forth any opinions. What is said in 100 pages could have been said in ...more
Doreen
Sep 26, 2012 Doreen rated it it was amazing  ·  review of another edition


Definitely thought provoking. Very pleased with how respectful these gentlemen were towards each others beliefs, especially with the hot topics we are experiencing during this election time.
Pao
Letto per il club Secretum Finis Africae: i saggi di Umberto d'Alessandria, comprato in formato digitale e riletto immediatamente.
L'aspetto che mi ha catturato del libro è stata la possibilità di leggere un dialogo fra persone che hanno idee diverse che si confrontano non per convincere l'altro della propria ragione ma per capire le idee dell'altro in un contesto di curiosità e mutuo rispetto che sembrano concetti così estranei al mondo attuale in cui si strepita per affermare le proprie verità
...more
Inder
An interesting and respectful little conversation between Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini (a Catholic and scholar) and Umberto Eco (an agnostic who knows more about Catholicism than ... well, practically anyone) about faith and ethics. There were some moments in this little volume when I felt the language was more flowery than it needed to be, while the depth was less than it could have been. And of course the debate is very Catholicism-centered, as you would expect given the debators (other religi ...more
Fabio
Apr 06, 2014 Fabio rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
Proof that discussion around religion (at least in other latitudes) can be elucidating and even cordial. As usual, Eco draws heavily from european (mostly medieval) history, and Aquinas, to make incisive points, not so much about the non-existence of god, a topic which he is too old to really be arguing like a village atheist, but to reveal the subtleties of doctrine and the historical, cultural, and theological issues of topics like the ordination of women and abortion.

Readers looking for boori
...more
Nelson Ramos
Nov 13, 2016 Nelson Ramos rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: top10
Depois de ler Barabbas (1950) de Pär Lagerkvist, um livro que atormenta o leitor com a questão metafilosófica da capacidade de acreditar ou não acreditar na religião, ler Belief or Non-Belief?: A Confrontation (1996) de Umberto Eco (1932-2016), tornou-se uma coincidência inexplicável. Já que encontrei o livro por acaso e no mesmo momento em que ainda estava a assimilar as ideias com que fiquei da leitura da obra do autor sueco.
A obra baseia-se na troca de correspondência entre o intelectual e C
...more
Johann Guenther
Dec 09, 2016 Johann Guenther rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
MARTINI, Carlo Maria; ECO, Umberto: „Woran glaubt, wer nicht glaubt?“, München 1999
Haben auch Nichtgläubige Werte? Unterscheiden sie zwischen GUT und BÖSE? Oder können das nur Gläubige. Über derartige Grundfragen diskutieren im Rahmen eines Briefwechsels der Mailänder Bischof und der Schriftsteller Umberto Eco. Eine geistreiche Auseinandersetzung, die neue Faktoren aufzeigt.
Kardinal König eröffnet den Diskurs mit Bezug auf den Club of Rome – einer nichtchristlichen Organisation -, die aber neben
...more
Kevin Sexton
A tedious correspondence with no big surprises. The writers spend a quarter of the book with formalities and congratulating each other on rigour. It gets into some interesting territory, like questioning the church's stance on women, but doesn’t begin to feel honest and meaty until the final correspondence. Then the book ends.

It's a reminder that discourse between believers and non-believers can be civil, and that’s about it.
Alberto Ríos Valles
Definitivamente un libro que vale la pena comprar. Al leer el libro no me tope con lo que esperaba al comprarlo, resulto ser mucho mejor. 100% recomendable.
Iván Madrigal
Dec 30, 2016 Iván Madrigal rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Hasta en los pensamientos más «refinados» podemos atisbar, diariamente, el desprecio por todo aquello que representa lo ajeno, lo extraño, lo absolutamente otro. Uno de los problemas de la otredad es su abordaje: cómo hacerlo sin pulverizarla o bien cómo introducirla sin permitir que esa tiranía de la mirada niegue la propia existencia.
Mark G
Dec 27, 2016 Mark G rated it it was amazing  ·  review of another edition
This review has been hidden because it contains spoilers. To view it, click here.
Jaime Menéndez
Feb 01, 2015 Jaime Menéndez rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Más que una confrontación, este libro es un diálogo educado -de hecho, muy educado- entre dos personajes de gran renombre en sus respectivos campos. Aclaro: a ambos los conozco mediante referencias de la cultura popular y no por sus escritos. Por lo tanto, la lectura de esta conversación epistolar, publicada originalmente en un periódico italiano, fue un descubrimiento gratificante y enriquecedor, aunque breve (102 páginas, apenas). En estos tiempos, cuando a veces las posiciones religiosas y se ...more
Roberto
Nov 14, 2015 Roberto rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
Si no le pongo cinco estrellas a este libro es porque simplemente me dejó con ganas de más.

En múltiples revisiones atribuyen todo el libro a Umberto Eco y he de confesar que fue el título acompañado de ese nombre lo que me hicieron comprarlo, pero Carlo María Martini no se queda para nada atrás. La manera en que se desenvuelve este diálogo epistolar es un claro ejemplo de como deberíamos actuar en la sociedad a pesar de nuestras diferencias ideológicas, dogmáticas, de fe, políticas, etc. El resp
...more
Alex Lee
Jun 13, 2014 Alex Lee rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
This short book follows the formula of a dialogue between the now secular (once Catholic) Umberto Eco and the Catholic Cardinal Carlo Martini. It it, they ask and answer each other questions dealing with believers and non-believers. The two gentlemen are gentlemen, ever clear, honest and respectful in how they speak to one another and express their views.

One of the greatest flaws people often have in dialogue with others of differing values is that they don't have a framework in which to approac
...more
Ricardo Homsi
Intelectuais italianos de perfil acadêmico são muito parecidos com suas contrapartes brasileiras: executam ocasionalmente pérolas de sabedoria que vale repetir, mas as deixam perdidas em um oceano de hermetismo e citações eruditas. O livro, que se vende como acessível desde a capa, é um diálogo travado por carta sem preocupação com acessibilidade -- são intelectuais travando um debate, limitados pelo espaço de suas missivas na publicação que originalmente os convidou. Eco, particularmente, traz ...more
Sancho
Feb 03, 2015 Sancho rated it liked it
An interesting exchange of letters between Umberto Eco (a secular man) and Carlo Maria Martini (a catholic cardinal), discussing topics that normally divide believers and non-believers.

In most of the book, Eco starts with a question and the cardinal answers it. The conversations are very polite and charged with philosophy and literature. The topics discussed are: the concept of apocalypsis, the beginning of human life, and the roles of men and women in the catholic church. At the end, the cardin
...more
Jacob
Jan 11, 2014 Jacob rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
Shelves: non-fiction
Perhaps better titled "Belief or Nonbelief in Catholicism" as while Eco claims to be a non-believer, the focus is squarely on debating the church's views. The brevity of the dialog makes it very accessible but also doesn't allow for much back and forth. The format is of open letters between Eco and Martini published in a newspaper. Eco opens the dialog with questions for the first three sets of letters. In my view Martini's responses were a bit typical. Essentially, 'there are so many mysteries ...more
♥ Ibrahim ♥
The book is not big but it is full of substance. I am a big fan of Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini. I try to read everything which he wrote and sit at his feel learning the lessons of the Gospel and try to soak them in. He is one of the best people that impressed me with his dialogue with Atheists and Agnostics. Very respectful. A book like this I can read to just learn the art of dialogue and thinking. Each have their convincing reasons for their arguments and each sounds attractive in his own int ...more
Isabel
Apr 09, 2010 Isabel rated it really liked it  ·  review of another edition
An interesting book. It presents a not unknown question, beliefs. What to people who say don't belief belief in? It makes you think about ethics, good, bad, normal, expected behaviors and ways of thinking. Showing the similarities and differences between catholics and "non-believers" it's a nice reading to look inside ourselves a bit more. To see more than what we believe in, what makes us believe.
Michael Laflamme
I found this book a bit of a disappointment considering the two geniuses that were behind it. The format, a correspondence between the two via the auspices of a newspaper, leaves little room for the the topics to be deeply explored. Each topic by both men is given barely an overview. Points are brought up and then not explored. I would like to see this type of approach in a longer, more thorough format that allows these two great minds to delve into the topics at hand.
Andrew
Nov 18, 2013 Andrew rated it liked it  ·  review of another edition
An enlightening discussion between two cultural heavyweights. As one very familiar with Martini and his viewpoints, and generally sympathetic to them, I especially enjoyed Eco's subtle but at times very thought-provoking explanations of a secularist, realist viewpoint of the world. As many have said, if nothing else, the works is a great testament to the level of civility that is possible for a dialogue between viewpoints that ultimately are not only different but opposed.
Conrado Villaseñor
This books is really a jewel......it is a epistolary conversation between Eco and Martini who is a cardinal and provides insight into Eco's religion beliefs. It shows Eco and Martini's respect for each other and their great sense of humor, particularly in a topic that becomes easily in a minefield.


Fred Kohn
Honestly, I was disappointed. I expected more from a person with the reputation of Eco. I felt he danced around issues quite a bit. On the other hand, Cardinal Martini was a joy. So, all in all, I'm happy to have read the book. Besides, I learned a great new word: cosmophage; which seems to fit our species perfectly.
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1730
Umberto Eco was an Italian writer of fiction, essays, academic texts, and children's books, and certainly one of the finest authors of the twentieth century. A professor of semiotics at the University of Bologna, Eco’s brilliant fiction is known for its playful use of language and symbols, its astonishing array of allusions and references, and clever use of puzzles and narrative inventions. His pe ...more
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“نظرگاه دینی همیشه شیوه های آرمانی زیستن را عرضه می کند، در حالی که فرد غیر مذهبی زندگی آرمانی را در انتخاب آزاد می بیند، مادامی که این انتخاب، انتخاب آزاد دیگران را مخدوش نکند” 5 likes
“امکان دارد انسان غیر مذهبی فکر کند شری که در خفا مرتکب می شود، نادیده می ماند. اما این را نیز به خاطر داشته باشید که اگر انسان غیر مذهبی فکر کند کسی از بالا مواظب او نیست، در عین حال درست به همین دلیل هم می داند کسی او را عفو نخواهد کرد....این شخص به مراتب بیش از دینداران امکان دارد بکوشد با اعتراف در حضور جمع خود را تطهیر کند. این شخص از دیگران طلب عفو خواهد کرد....و به همین دلیل پیشاپیش می داند باید دیگران را ببخشاید” 4 likes
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