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Foundation's Triumph (Second Foundation Trilogy #3)

by David Brin (Goodreads Author)

3.84 of 5 stars 3.84 · rating details · 3,870 ratings · 29 reviews

Isaac Asimov's Foundation Trilogy is one of the highwater marks of science fiction.The monumental story of a Galactic Empire in decline and a secret society of scientists who seek to shorten the coming Dark Age with tools of Psychohistory, Foundation pioneered many themes of modern science fiction.Now, with the approval of the Asimov estate, three of today's most acclaimed...more

Paperback, 392 pages

Published June 1st 2000 by HarperTorch (first published 1999)

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Mar 18, 2011 Phil Giunta rated it 4 of 5 stars

Isaac Asimov's classic Foundation series comes to a conclusion in a trilogy of novels each written by different noted SF authors. David Brin adequately delivers the final entry, Foundation's Triumph, with similar pacing and style as Greg Bear's Foundation and Chaos. Like Bear, Brin minimizes story elements introduced in Gregory Benford's opening book, Foundation's Fear. I was grateful for that, since Benford's 600 page sleeper was a disappointment and could have been trimmed by half.

I described...more Isaac Asimov's classic Foundation series comes to a conclusion in a trilogy of novels each written by different noted SF authors. David Brin adequately delivers the final entry, Foundation's Triumph, with similar pacing and style as Greg Bear's Foundation and Chaos. Like Bear, Brin minimizes story elements introduced in Gregory Benford's opening book, Foundation's Fear. I was grateful for that, since Benford's 600 page sleeper was a disappointment and could have been trimmed by half.

I described Brin's book as "adequate" mostly due to an ending that, to this reader, seemed like a chapter of exposition disguised as a philosophical discussion between aging protagonist Hari Seldon and the mysterious puppet-master, robot Daneel Olivaw. Both of these characters had been present from the very beginning of the Foundation series, with Olivaw then disguised as the galactic Emperor's right hand man, First Minister Eto Demerzel. Olivaw then vanished and re-appeared sparingly until the very end when elements threatened his grand plan for the future of humanity.

We learn in Brin's novel some startling facts about Olivaw's involvement in Hari Seldon's childhood years when the brilliant "mathist" began to show promise, alluding to the possibility that Olivaw had guided the burgeoning genius toward his career-defining discovery of "psychohistory"--a complex set of mathematical formulas for defining the future of the galactic Empire.

In the first half of Foundation's Triumph, Brin also picks up on Bear's introduction of "mentalics", humans with varying levels of telepathic abilities. It is clear that Seldon had not accounted for these elements in his psychohistorical equations and adapts to this by forming a secretive Second Foundation elsewhere in the galaxy. However, about mid-way through Brin's tale, the mentalics seem to fade into the background and the robots take the forefront. We learn more about the different sects of robots, some who follow Olivaw's teachings, others that oppose it, and yet more who fall somewhere in between.

Treated a bit more lightly by Brin are Seldon's robotic wife, Dors Venabili, and the emancipated robot Lodovik Trema. Sometime between Benford and Bear, Dors had faked her own death when she was recalled by Olivaw to be reassigned elsewhere. Trema was introduced in Foundation and Chaos as a robot once loyal to Olivaw but whose positronic brain was altered by a surge of neutrinos. This unexpected event caused Trema to question the Three Laws of Robotics set forth by Olivaw. Eventually, Trema decides that he is no longer bound by them and acts on his own volition.

Brin restricts Trema and Dors to the sidelines in Foundation's Triumph, at one point leaving them stranded in outer space for several chapters aboard one ship. Rather than completely abandoning them, however, Brin uses their predicament to soften Dors distrust of Trema. Shortly into the story, Dors is already questioning the motives of her master, Daneel Olivaw as a result of ancient robotic records given to her by Trema. By the end, Dors wants nothing more than to return to Hari Seldon's side one last time before he dies--a scene which Brin denies us. It never happens.

We'll never know if this is what the late Isaac Asimov intended for his beloved Foundation series. At the same time, I can appreciate the challenges faced by authors who undertake projects based in another writer's universe, especially when they are denied the benefit of that writer's consultation.
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Jan 12, 2011 Lis Carey rated it 4 of 5 stars

Shelves: f-sf

This review has been hidden because it contains spoilers. To view it, click here. SPOILERS AHEAD; SKIP IF YOU'RE PLANNING TO READ THIS AND DON'T WANT TO KNOW. This is the third book in the new Foundation trilogy, and it's quite an interesting addition. Hari Seldon, now old, isolated from what's left of his family by the exigencies of the Plan, and no longer a major object of suspicion for the Imperial security forces, decides to pursue a minor mystery brought to him by a minor bureaucrat who has been working at the mathematics of psychohistory as a hobby. The mystery concerns...more SPOILERS AHEAD; SKIP IF YOU'RE PLANNING TO READ THIS AND DON'T WANT TO KNOW. This is the third book in the new Foundation trilogy, and it's quite an interesting addition. Hari Seldon, now old, isolated from what's left of his family by the exigencies of the Plan, and no longer a major object of suspicion for the Imperial security forces, decides to pursue a minor mystery brought to him by a minor bureaucrat who has been working at the mathematics of psychohistory as a hobby. The mystery concerns "tilling", the fact that nearly every human-inhabited planet was subjected to a major churning and grinding of the soil, making it suitable for agriculture, before humans arrived--in an expanding wave just ahead of the wave of human colonial expansion, in fact. There are exceptions, though, worlds where the process didn't happen, and substantial amounts of life unlike the life on most human worlds still survives. What do these anomalies mean? Why do they appear to track so well with the distribution of "chaos worlds", the worlds that experience a runaway outbreak of advancing science, art, and technology, before collapsing into equally runaway disaster?

Hari quickly discovers he's on the trail of something very important to psycohistory and the Plan, and Daneel, the Calvinian robots, imperial security, and several other forces are in hot pursuit of him. All fairly standard, except for where Brin takes this. Put simply, not only is psychohistory wrong, in the sense of inaccurate and inadequate to the job Hari's trying to do with it, but the goal is wrong. Hari's Plan rests on certain assumptions about human nature and human capacity that are not correct, based on facts which are incomplete and which have been subjected to seriously flawed analysis by Daneel and Giskard, which have never been checked against the wishes and opinions of humans. And Daneel has deliberately deceived Hari Seldon about these facts. He has done it from the best of motives, but he's wrong. He's concerned only with taking the safest path for the human species, not the best path; because of the Three Laws, and the Zeroth Law, he can't really distinguish between the two. Hari's plan is really Daneel's plan, and it's a mistake. At the end, it appears that Daneel's plan is triumphant; the hope for a genuinely human future--and perhaps a future where humans may finally be able to run the risk of meeting intelligent aliens--is that Hari's Foundation will be more robust than Hari or Daneel have believed, and prevent Daneel's rather horrifying, but very safe, Gaia plan from coming to fruition.

Altogether, a rather darker and more interesting book than I expected.(less)

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Jan 15, 2012 Debbie rated it 1 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: science-fiction-fantasy, 1-star

I am a fan of most of David Brin's books but guess this trilogy too deep/profound for me or something -- not a good story. Too much philosophy and not enough story (or even a good job carrying the what-if theme of everything in Asimov's original vision). Take away name of title, places and characters and I would never have suspected this had anything to do with Foundation novels.

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Aug 24, 2012 Brian rated it 3 of 5 stars

When a favourite author writes in a favourite universe, you hope the results will be awesome. Unfortunately it was just "meh". Asimov's Hari Seldon molded the future of the galaxy and mankind as he knew it into his own vision of perfection. Brin's Seldon refuses to do the same. The situations, backgrounds and major players keep setting up to be special and repeatedly fall short.
Don't get me wrong, Brin doesn't slight Asimov's work, he just takes it in a direction that doesn't work for me. Maybe...more

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Apr 06, 2012 Ethan I. Solomon rated it 2 of 5 stars · review of another edition

I think that giving two stars to any of the books from this trilogy is actually being very generous, and is mostly because of the names involved and thus the quality they brought to the books. Nevertheless the books are a complete failure despite being set in Asimov's universe. The authors attempted to bring some of Asimov's genius to the table but were unable to convey their ideas in the gloriously simple and direct fashion that Asimov could. As a result the entire trilogy is extremely convolut...more

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Oct 17, 2010 Colleen rated it 3 of 5 stars

Shelves: science-fiction

Brin's a good writer and I really liked Asimov's Foundation Trilogy when I read it in college, but I didn't particularly like this extension of the original. I guess utopias have lost their appeal. I didn't realize how devoid of action the original foundation books were. And this book was mostly conversations and theory. The omnicient computers run the universe and humans just have to follow their dictates. They've determined that some humans must be eliminated for the majority to be happy. Not...more

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Oct 23, 2011 manuti rated it 1 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Y fin a esta trilogía de la lista de libros de 2008 – 2009. Después de los dos anteriores ([1] y [2]), creo que este es el peor. Ahonda en la novela barata de ciencia ficción y en los embrollos de los robots y su inevitable necesidad de proteger a los humanos. Así que se queda con 1 sola estrella.

Como conclusión de esta nueva trilogía, solo decir que en general es entretenida, que para los seguidores de Asimov y de las novelas del ciclo de la Fundación puede ser un añadido interesante, pero que

...more

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Mar 08, 2013 Gabriel rated it 3 of 5 stars

Solo he podido leer fundación y caos que a pesar de ser una buena novela me causo todo un shock en cuanto a ser una continuación de la saga creado por Isac Asimov, sensasión muy diferente a la que causa esta tercera entrega, realmente el estilo incluso es muy parecido al del finado maestro Asimov, retoma cuestiones de estilo como el hecho de citar a la enciclopedia galactica que nos remiten a las primera trilogia de la fundación, y sobre todos para aquellos fanaticos como un servidor de el cread...more

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May 18, 2013 JP rated it 3 of 5 stars

This "second conclusion" was anti-climactic for me. The writing itself is great and nicely consistent with Asimov's style. However, I found the whole peace vs. free will thing a bit predictable and hence overly attended across three hundred pages. The characterization is nice, especially Dors and Trema. The afterward includes a timeline of all the works - tight, yet with plenty of unexplored topics and space as fodder for future works.

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Aug 04, 2011 Daniel McGill rated it 3 of 5 stars

By far the best of the "new foundation trilogy" but I do not recommend reading the series, the guy who wrote the fist book did so much damage to the story to the point of not even using Asimov's physics that between them even Brin and the guy who wrote the middle book couldn't undo it all. Only read if you're a fanatical completionist.

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Aug 16, 2011 Steven Cole rated it 3 of 5 stars

A good conclusion to the Second Foundation Trilogy. I like Brin as an author, and he doesn't disappoint here. As the ending approached, I found it hard to put the book down, which is a good sign. This is basically the story of Hari Seldon's final days, as he discovers the secrets of Daneel's manipulations over the eons.

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Jul 05, 2008 Michael rated it 4 of 5 stars Recommends it for: fans of the Foundation books; David Brin fans

Shelves: fiction, science-fiction

I spotted this in our local used bookstore as I was looking for new books by David Brin. "He's written a Foundation novel???" Hmmm.... I like Isaac Asimov, and I like David Brin. Let's give 'er a try!

I was not disappointed. Brin's writing was crisp and a pleasure to read. I did not read these three books of the Second Foundation Trilogy in order, and I'm glad I did not. For readers of Asimov's Foundation books, these books fill in some gaps in the story in the years leading up to Hari Seldon's d...more

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Feb 21, 2012 Jeff Crosby rated it 3 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: science-fiction, ebook, 2012, ibooks

It has been over a decade since I read the first two volumes of this new Foundation trilogy. I liked Foundation's Fear by Gregory Benford, but I disliked Greg Bear's Foundation and Chaos. So, I never picked up this final volume until now. I'm glad it finally caught my attention. The opening chapters draw together the threads from the first two novels, setting up an interesting premise. The first two thirds of the book are very engaging, but it gets lost as we reveal conspiracy after conspiracy--...more

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Nov 11, 2010 John rated it 4 of 5 stars

It must be difficult to write a story that takes place sandwiched between events conceived by other authors. (Sounds like a writer's workshop exercise.) But that is what Brin has done, and succeeded on the level of the narrative. He was less successful in his wordsmithing, however. Too many repeated turns of phrase suggest to me a rush writing job (and a lax editing job).

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Feb 13, 2011 John Derderian rated it 3 of 5 stars

This was the best of the 3B trilogy, and the only one that felt at all in the spirit of Asimov's originals. You probably have to read the other two to really appreciate this one, and I can't really recommend that.

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May 09, 2008 Kip rated it 3 of 5 stars

Got these three (Second Foundation Trilogy) from a friend. Been a long time since I read the Foundation or robot stories from Asimov, so I was eager to jump back into the story.

All three authors did a good job remaining true to the original timelines, major events and characters. That said, you could tell this was sort of filler. Should have expected that, right?

Has motivated me to go back and read some of the robot stories again -- lots of robot activity in all three of these.

* Couldn't finish
*...more

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Jul 05, 2007 Sarah rated it 2 of 5 stars

Brin has some very interesting ideas in this book, but I think overall it's very poorly executed. He turns Daneel into a crazed megalomaniac and makes the robots responsible for the entire course of human history, and he attempts to explain Asimov's other books in terms of this robot theory, which is an interesting concept, but I think Asimov would be rolling in his grave. This was also just really difficult to get into, and confusing to try to keep track of who was on which side when, who was b...more

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Jun 19, 2011 Bruce Jones rated it 3 of 5 stars

David Brin finishes the new Foundation trilogy with extensive speculation about the role of superior robots with a dedication to help humans.

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Sep 26, 2012 Howard rated it 2 of 5 stars

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Sep 23, 2012 Garrett rated it 5 of 5 stars

I applaud Brin for closing this trilogy in Asimov's universe on a high-note. The other books left me a little disappointed, but this one felt closer to Asimov's tendencies and ideas. However, one of Asimov's failings is the lack of action, and this book also suffered from that a bit - too much time in meditation and talk and not enough action by the humans. Of course, perhaps that is part of the point being made. But I expected more from HAri, even if he is 90 years old ;-)

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Jun 21, 2012 Christian rated it 2 of 5 stars

Ameno y fácil de leer, pero innecesario. Intenta profundizar con algunos guiños a Un guijarro en el cielo y Fundación y Tierra pero lamentablemente se queda en el camino. Con respecto al tema en general, tranquilamente la Trilogía puede terminar en el segundo libro.

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Jul 30, 2010 Marc marked it as to-read

Shelves: foundation, wishlist, sci-fi

Foundation's Triumph (Second Foundation Trilogy) by David Brin (2000)

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Apr 10, 2013 Anthony Orso rated it 2 of 5 stars

I usually enjoy Brin's work and thought Asimov was a master. This book was anti-climactic and felt very dated.

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May 16, 2013 Mars rated it 3 of 5 stars

Shelves: owned-not-reviewed

This ties up some loose ends in the story, and is mostly pretty decent, but also includes gratuitous spoilers, endless repetition of the same arguments and points, occasionally dull dialogue, and a number of deux ex machinae.

Overall, it's not terrible but I can't say I'm impressed.

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Sep 05, 2011 David Burkam rated it 3 of 5 stars · review of another edition

Shelves: sci-fi

The final entry in this trilogy probably deserves *** 1/2, but all of them seemed overplotted.

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Oct 24, 2008 Bill added it

Not as good as the original foundation trilogy

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Nov 29, 2012 Frank rated it 5 of 5 stars

The best by FAR of the three post Asimov Foundation/Robots finale books.

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Apr 30, 2011 David rated it 2 of 5 stars

Shelves: cleanskin

a let down

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Jul 21, 2010 Theresa rated it 4 of 5 stars

A satisfying end!

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Sep 16, 2010 Barry added it

Shelves: science-fiction

First read 2/08

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About David Brin

David Brin is a scientist, speaker, and world-known author. His novels have been New York Times Bestsellers, winning multiple Hugo, Nebula and other awards. At least a dozen have been translated into more than twenty languages.

Existence, his latest novel, offers an unusual scenario for first contact. His ecological thriller, Earth, foreshadowed global warming, cyberwarfare and near-future trends...more

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Foundation's Triumph (Second Foundation Trilogy #3)

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